How best to handle complex chord names, and one possible usage bug.
I'm enjoying learning more abut Musescore. You folks have obviously put a lot of thought into the workflow and user interface.
I have a question about how best to input chord names that the xml files are not familiar with. For example, I can enter a Dmaj7, or a Dadd2, and it formats beautifully. But, it doesn't like it when I attempt a Dmaj7add2 chord. Is this going to be a matter of hand editing the xml file?
The possible usage bug:
When using the cchords_sym.xml file, it displays a major 7 chord as a triangle. C(triangle), for example. But I've never used it this way. The triangle symbol simply means 'major,' so a C major 7 chord would be C(triangle)7. This is the common practice I am most familiar with.
Thank you,
-Paul Henry
Comments
Yes, the XML files are what control the recognition of chords. So if there is a chord you need recognize that isn't, editing the XML file is the way to go. But do realize, that will mean your scores wont display correctly on other people's systems, including musescore.com. In most cases, even if the particualr spelling you have in mind isn't supported in any of the provided XMl files, some other spelling is. For instance, Dmaj7add2 is known more simlly as Dmaj9. They consist of the exact same notes, but the latter name is both simpler to type, shorter to display,and far more commonly used and hence easier to recognize.
As for the triangle, while I am sure thwe are some circles in which a teiangle by itself implies a triad and an explicit seventh is needed to mean major seventh, that is in my experience - jazz, primarily - nowhere near as common as use of the triangle to mean major seventh. Indeed, chord symbols indicating traids are practially unheard of in jazz, but if you want a major teiad, you normally don't need a triangle - just the root alone implies a major triad. So I designed that file to work that way by default. However, if you dig into the file, you'll see I did allow for the possibility of customizing this to support the usage you are apparently more familiar with. In any event, triangles are deprecated by almost all mahor publishers these days; they definitely seem to be on the way out.
In reply to Yes, the XML files are what by Marc Sabatella
can go, then. I'll use a different xml file. You're right about the maj7add2 vs. maj9, of course. I don't know why I didn't see that. I'm transcribing old lead sheets I have into Musescore to evaluate it and learn the flow at the same time. Except for chord diagrams, Musescore does everything I need.
I still need a method to deal with complex chords. Though my example was a poor one, there are chords and voicings that do fall out of the range of the xml files. How would you enter a chord name where the notes are F# A C# D G ?
It's an Fm with a b9 and b13, no 7. I would guess that, at this point, I am back to the choices you mentioned in your first reply.
In any case, thank you for the help.
-Paul
In reply to Thanks, Marc. The triangles by Paul Henry
In general, you can't name every possible combination of notes with a meaningful chord symbol name, nor should you want to. That's not a MuseScore restriction, but just a general observation on the nature of chord symbols. Think about the *purpose* of a chord symbol: it's to give a musician enough information to figure out for himself an appropriate combination notes to use that works for him in that particular context. If you have a very specific set of notes you need played for whatever reason, then don't try to trick a musician into figuring it out by using a cleverly wordsmithed chord symbol - just write out the notes in ordinary notation. Chord symbols are more for cases where you don't mind giving people flexibility.
So your question shouldn't be, what do I call F# A C# D G, but rather, a series of questions: why do I want a musician to play those notes, and are there any other notes he could play instead or in addition, or any notes he could leave out, that would nonetheless still give the right sound? If the bottom line is that those are the only notes he can possibly play and sound right, just write them out. If the intent is to create an F# minor sound in which a b9 and b13 appear somewhere, then a seventh is *not* inconsistent with that sound, and just because the originally written voicing happened to omit it doesn't mean everyone else playing the piece has to omit it also. Again, if you absolutely cannot have a seventh, just write it out. A complex chord symbol like F#mi7b9b13no7 is just going to draw blank stares, and likely result in people playing some wrong notes or arranging those notes in ways that is just as incompatible with your desires as including a seventh would have been.
Again, this is just good general practical advice on chord symbols, from someone who has to read them for a living. Chord symbols with more than about 6 or 7 characters in them end up being counterproductive most of the time.
In reply to In general, you can't name by Marc Sabatella
But I must disagree with you on some of them. This comes from my perspective of a few paltry decades of songwriting, and the fact (not to be underestimated) that I'm lazy. Very lazy.
Of course, a musician reading one of my lead sheets can play whatever they want; but I feel a certain obligation as the writer to get across specific voicings when they are important to the song. If an Fmb6b9 is important, I want to be able to write it that way. It's not the exact notes, but the color that's important to me. How the player eventually plays it is up to them, but at least they'll know what I'm after.
You are right to say that I could just write the notes out. But, exactly how would that work? (Here's where the laziness comes in.) Do I write out the notes just for those chords I care about, and how do I do that on a lead sheet? Have two staves with the occasional chord cluster in it? Awkward and ugly. I don't want to write out an exact guitar part. WAY too much work, and would involve writing down everything including specifics when I don't want them. Do I include a glossary of voicings on a back page? Still have the problem. I could write a chord symbol, say an Fmb9, that Musescore likes, then have the voicing in the chord glossary at the end that says "Fmb9," but in fact also has a b13 in it. And if I write "Fmb13" that doesn't imply the b9. So, I'm still stuck as to a decent workflow. I'll figure out something.
Thanks again. You've been very gracious with your time and thoughtful responses.
In reply to Thanks, Marc. You make some good points. by Paul Henry
I can't stop you from writing Fmb6b9. I can just tell you, as a professional musician and educator for many years, that it is very unlikely this will have the effect you desire. Some musicians will ignore it as being too unfamiliar and just play F minor., Others will attempt to play it literally but will end up with a different voicing than you intended and that will probably sound very different and probably much worse. Others still will make the attempt to invent a voicing actually get the details wrong. And others - the majority of professional musicians, in my experience - will simply add a seventh anyhow if in their professional opinion it suits the context. So again, write if you like; I'm just saying it's unlikely to have the effect you think it will.
As for how to write it out should so so choose, I would assume if you have a specific voicing in mind, you might also have a specific beat you want it play on (or you could use whole notes if not). Most straightforward is just to put it in a separate voice on the same staff if there are just one or two of these. If there are a lot, a second staff will be much easier to read and will get you results closer to what you intended. Use slashes where you don't care about specific voicings, write out the voicings where you do. It's not actually particularly difficult or uncommon.
But again, if you feel you'd rather write Fmb9b13, go ahead - you'll just have to edit the chord description file by hand to get it. In 2.0, it will apparently become possible to do some amount of customization without needing to edit the file by hand, but I don't know if that will extend to adding new chords.