Minimum fret entry for guitar tablature
Hi, when arranging the fingering for guitar tab, it would be very helpful if one could specify the *lowest* fret number to use for a set of selected notes.
This is used in other programs, and allows one to set the playing position quickly.
Maybe just a dialog box with a shortcut?
Sorry if this is somehow already supported and I missed it, but I figured the default is "MuseScore selects the string and the fret: always the highest possible string is selected."
Awesome program, many thanks. MT
Comments
...but assuming standard tuning on a 6 string guitar, isn't the *lowest* fret number for any selected note found on the highest sounding string where that note can be played?
In other words, to play that same note on a lower sounding string requires moving to a higher fret, yes?
(Hope this makes sense...)
Regards.
In reply to Not quite sure what you mean... by Jm6stringer
Hi again, sorry, I see that my formulation could be misleading.
effectively, I mean to allow the user to define the guitar neck position for a set of notes.
For generating tab for a set of notes, this can be achieved by specifying a minimum fret number to use - i.e. use the lowest fret number for the note which is >= to that specified, forcing the notes onto a lower pitched string, and hence into the desired neck position.
At present, that minimum fret number is effectively zero.
As a concrete example, for a 2-octave natural A minor, one would specify "5" as the minimum fret to use, and the resulting tab would only use the frets 5-9 (not 0-4).
I was using a Musescore 2.0 nightly build yesterday to arrange some tab from a linked notation staff - indeed one can manually change the strings used with , but it often is the case that to bring a set of notes into a specific neck position they all need to be moved by different amounts (so a potentially 1-click operation gets very tedious).
I can imagine many guitar-playing users would benefit from this, especially if they start with an imported melody, and start arranging the fingering for (electric) guitar.
Best regards, MT
In reply to Minimum fret position to use to generate guitar tablature by NZMark
Oh... I see.
You wish to specify a minimum fret number so that the notes will be fingered at a higher position on the guitar neck - unlike the default which seems to favor the *absolute* minimum.
With a linked treble/tablature staff I can see how this might come in handy for composing scales in the various positions without having to correct the default TAB notation.
While I consider the linked staves a convenience, I don't know if what you want is possible in MuseScore.
It is this nature of tablature - to specify from the possibilities where to play a given note - which makes TAB popular among string players. (After all, middle 'C' on a piano keyboard is always in the same spot.)
My own experience with tablature vs. standard notation is that, for me, tablature mainly comes in handy for tricky passages - to demonstrate a *clever* solution (often using open strings). This is especially true when learning finger-style solo arrangements; or even mastering a lead guitar passage which can be 'all over the place'.
So, whenever I use TAB, (not too often as it's still brand new) I usually don't link the staves; and for the mundane stuff (lead sheets, or even scale passages in various positions) I rely solely on treble clef notation.
Hoping you find a solution...
Regards.
In reply to Minimum fret entry by Jm6stringer
Dear jm,
I guess we are in complete agreement here, but I still think it would be a very useful improvement to implement this.
Granted, one can add neck position (and left finger indices) to the treble clef staff (as per classical guitar scores), but with heavy key signatures/accidentals etc. the tab is very helpful to learn complex arrangements, e.g. long lead solos. The "clever" solutions there are often sequences of neck positions to achieve flow between measures (way up on the fret board, seldom open strings).
This "set minimum fret for generating tab" is indeed implemented in some commercial programs (e.g. my ancient version of Encore).
I can imagine extending the code to include this would be a little tedious (it seems a very decent job has been done already, supporting arbitrary string tunings etc.). I would like this feature so much - can one offer to write some code fragments?
The linked staves (treble + tab ) feature is very important, being widespread in electric guitar music books. But this was somewhat a side issue... the key point is to get the right tab notated as quickly as possible.
Still, great program. Regards, MT
In reply to Minimum fret entry by NZMark
Well, I gave it a shot...
Using linked treble/tablature staves, and by tweaking the String Data (i.e. guitar tuning), while taking into account MuseScore's preference for the *lowest* fret, I came up with this:
NOT FOUND: 1
As you can see, adding +4 will give the correct fret numbers for the linked TAB staff - in this case, a two-octave A major scale (with '4' as the minimum fret to use).
However, it seems I cannot increment *all* the fret numbers - as a group.
(Much like the 'Add to measure no.' does for incrementing measure counts.)
For the upcoming MuseScore 2.0 (currently in beta) additional new features are closed until the stable release - which may occur by year's end.
As you mentioned, this 'minimum fret entry' feature is implemented with other programs; and electric guitar books do indeed rely heavily on TAB/neck positions which can show more info. than what appears in standard notation.
Perhaps when the smoke clears (after the 2.0 stable release) you and I can bump this feature back to the front of this feature request forum.
Regards.
I'm still thinking about this 'minimum fret' TAB notation using linked treble/TAB staves...
You wrote:
"As a concrete example, for a 2-octave natural A minor, one would specify "5" as the minimum fret to use, and the resulting tab would only use the frets 5-9 (not 0-4)."
So, you mean something like this, done with linked staves:
NOT FOUND: 1
The minor scale above is played at the fifth position (5th fret), unlike the default rendering which uses open strings and/or lower frets
Earlier, I had posted my example of an A major scale in fourth position, but I wasn't able to increment all the TAB numbers by +4 without messing up the linked treble staff.
It appears there could be a viable workaround:
1. Create an unlinked TAB staff into which is copied the linked TAB.
2. Select the entire unlinked TAB staff and use the arrow key to raise all the fret numbers as a group. (This action will not affect the treble clef staff.)
3. When done with all note entry/editing, use the menu item: Add / Instruments to remove the linked TAB staff, leaving you with the above example.
4. BTW: The TAB staff is good for viewing and printing (but should be muted for playback, because the TAB strings, unlike the treble clef strings, are tuned to a capo placed at the specified (in this case, 5th) fret).
Regards.
In reply to @NZMark...Re: Your earlier 'concrete example' by Jm6stringer
Hi again,
thanks for your efforts. I will have to survive with the slower mode of string editing for now
(BTW: just checked out a demo of Magic Score Maestro - same limitations. Power Tab Editor has some interesting tab position functionality, but there are so many other functionality/handling issues...).
In terms of a fully-fledged feature suggestion, I would add a "Position" attribute to each note (albeit only meaningful for stringed instruments), not just for the calculation of the desired tab string/fret but also to allow automatic annotation of the position on a linked clef staff (i.e. standard roman numerals on guitar score).
I will add some screen shots of Musecore 2.0 nightly vs. my ancient Encore at some point to demonstrate why this has such a big impact when arranging the tab in certain contexts.
Many thanks again.
P.S. Is there any way for users to contribute to the code development?
In reply to Fast tab entry with given neck position by NZMark
Regarding your PS, of course there is !
The code is here https://github.com/musescore/MuseScore
Instructions to compile it : http://musescore.org/en/developers-handbook/compilation
Contribution workflow http://musescore.org/en/developers-handbook/git-workflow
If you need help with setting up your environment etc... you can find some developers on #musescore or freenode.net or on the developer mailing list http://dev-list.musescore.org
In reply to Fast tab entry with given neck position by NZMark
Regarding 'user selected' minimum fret:
As you probably know, each of my posted examples of a scale played at a higher neck position than the default rendering, is locked into that position - just as the default TAB rendering is locked into using open string and/or minimum fret. So, for the example of an A (harmonic) minor scale at 5th position, notes above the 'C' on the 8th fret, 1st string would encounter the same problem. That is, being locked into one neck position may be fine for practicing routine scale exercises; but for actual performance, the need to shift playing positions dynamically is why I usually don't link the treble/TAB staves.
However, creating linked treble/TAB staves with the ability to render TAB neck positions (as related to the standard practice of using roman numerals in the treble clef) is a great idea.
Should you decide to post screenshot(s) comparing the MuseScore nightly to Encore, I would ask that you also post an actual MuseScore (.mscz) file with those specific issues you mention. This way, we could all experiment with various attempts at finding solutions.
Regards.
In reply to @NZMark...Arranging TAB by Jm6stringer
Hi again,
many thanks for all the feedback. After looking at the procedure for code development, I might first try creating a plugin for achieving this. Hopefully there is enough support in the plugin classes! I will post some queries in the Plugin Forum ("Modifying Tab").
Regards, MT
In reply to Tab with specific neck position for each set of notes by NZMark
NZMark, I know exactly what you mean about the lowest fret and I'm quite familiar with the ancient Encore which made this very easy. Just curious if you had any luck doing a plugin for this functionality? MuseScore looks to be about the only possible viable alternative to the old Encore, which is still the most user friendly and intuitive software that ever lived for music notation. But that program is essentially dead now, little to no development going on these days and it crashes all over the place.
I noticed something about tablature fingerings in the release notes for 2.1. Is this "lowest fret" issue fixed in the newest version?
In reply to I noticed something about by mikec
You mean #176511: Allow fingerings in tablature staffs? I don't see how that might be related