Swing on ''13th Invention'' N° 1

• Oct 11, 2015 - 17:29

Some Thougths on "Play Bach"

Others did something similar before; for example "The Nice", "Emerson, Lake&Palmer", "Walter Carlos on LP Switched on Bach", and "Ian Anderson (Jethro Tull)" played Baroque Music in modern ways on actual instruments.

Might somebody see the use of his music this way as "without respect to the great baroque musician?" No, Sir!

Everything begins with the question: If he were living today, what kind of music would the big master of composers, Johann Sebastian Bach, create with the instruments and sound studios, the PCs and software like "MuseScore" we have nowadays?

I believe: If Johann Sebastian Bach happens to meet some good Ragtime,- Blues-, Skiffle-, Dixieland-Jazz-, Swing-, or Rock-Musician, at the Sound Paradise Studio in Musican's Heaven? (Think of: Scott Joplin, Irving Berliner, Louis "Satchmo" Armstrong, Bessie Smith, Gene Krupa, Albert Ammons, Glenn Miller, Aker Bilk, Janice Joplin, Jimi Hendrix or Rory Gallagher) They'll take some little drink first, then they'll set some accords on a lead sheet, pickup their instruments, and then there will be a VERY BIG JAM SESSION! With dancing blessed souls, swingin' angels, standing ovations from all saints, and after that, even the 12 Apostles will rename themselves to "The hot 12"! In Eternity, Amen!

FarrierPete

Attachment Size
Swing on13th Invention 1.mscz 41.28 KB

Comments

Premise: Everybody is (and shall!) be free to play whatever (s)he likes in whatever manner (s)he likes!

Swing & Baroque Music: hmmm... well.... swing has not been invented by XX c. music; it was widely and consistently used in Baroque music, simply under another name; the "purists" (a term with which I strongly disagree) know it under the name of inégalité and it is described in many (most?) musical tracts and instrumental methods since the end of XVII c. to the second half of XVIII c.

Some consider it a specific French feature, and it maybe originated from France, but quickly spread to all Europe. As a very late and extreme example, I heard once a mechanical "music box" made in Nürnberg on the turn of XVIII / XIX c. playing the ouverture from Le Nozze di Figaro with quite a heavy inégalité on the quavers.

So, I don't see (and most "purists" would not see) anything strange in applying "swing/inégalité" to Bach music. Perhaps, as Baroque music was all about variety, a mechanical application of it would result boring after the second musical phrase, but this is of course a (more than reasonable!) limitation of the playback mechanism, rather than of the inégalité concept.

To my taste, the 60% ratio you used sounds a little bit too heavy: something in the range 55-57% would sound to me more nonchalant (it. sprezzatura, another very important concept for Baroque style). But of course there is much of subjective in this; for instance, if I remember correctly, Dom Bedos de Celles in the fourth part of his L’Art du facteur d’orgues, dedicated to mechanical organs, defines and employs quite heavy inégalités.

So, inégalité at last!!!! Thanks!

M.

P.S.: More comments on other aspects of your rendition will follow shortly...

In reply to by FarrierPete

Nice!
Even using the default FluidR3Mono_GM.sf3 soundfont; plus with the Square Lead, and the Bass + Lead patches, this rendition definitely sounds like it's from Walter Carlos' Switched on Bach album.
(I recall how impressed I was when I first heard the 'synthesized' Third Brandenberg Concerto on that album.)

Regards.

In reply to by Jm6stringer

Thanks for that little compliment, Jm6stringer,
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Yeah, that was down in 1968... nearly 50 years ago now... Some classmate brought the LP to school. Music-teacher and class listened to Walter Carlos on the Moog sounding from that Vinyl on the old recordplayer. Teacher's mouth stood open for quite a while after that! B^))
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But what did you say, Jm6stringer ... "Even using the default FluidR3Mono_GM.sf3 soundfont"?
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>> Hehe... B^) <<
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Might it be that this little soundfont only needs some "polish" to proove it's qualities as instrument? Yeah, you are right, there indeed is a hidden track inside that score, that's responsible for some more reverb, chorus and harmonics sounding at Replay-time.
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If you're interested in "how to": Take a swift look at:
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> https://musescore.com/user/28092/scores/1221071 ,
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... for some example enhancing Harp and Acc. Guitar. That "Mixing" works with "Synths", too!
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Further, you are invited to join some discussion at
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> https://musescore.com/groups/improving-musescore-com/discuss/1251526
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Have Fun, and: Set the Music free!
Sincerely
FarrierPete
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PS: Some testing of .sf3-"Bagpipe Sound" will follow soon at "Made with Musescore". Look for "Cry for a Butchered Generation - The Battle of the Somme"

" If Johann Sebastian Bach happens to meet some good [put your favorite genre here]...":

Oh well, this is like opening a bee-hive, but I'll try to say all I have to say on that and then I'll shut down.

Let me for the sake of the argument put aside for a moment the basic objection that, with "if"s and "but"s, one goes not very far and let me follow the assumption.

If Bach (or Monteverdi, or Dufay, or whoever) had known the XX c. genres..., ...he would had lived in the XX c.! He would have known a different musical environment, with different instruments, different musical languages and styles, a different tradition to look back at, and so on. Nobody could tell which kind of music he would have written (maybe, he would have become a software programmer or an astronaut!), but, for sure, he would have written different music!

But in fact, Bach lived in that time, knew those musical instruments and those musical languages, styles and that tradition and eventually wrote that music. All parts hold together.

Now, taking that 'musical whole', slicing it and taking some parts of it (in this case, the written notes) while rejecting all the other parts is without any doubt a legitimate operation: music did always rely (also) on re-visitations, re-arrangements and so on (something that the modern Lords of the Copyright utterly forgot! and which Bach himself practised repeatedly).

What I believe not to be legitimate is claiming that the result of such an operation is "Bach" (or "Monteverdi" or "Dufay"): "this is (possibly) what Bach would have written if...": absolutely not! The result, in the best cases, is Bach-Busoni or Bach-Bahrami, but it cannot be claimed to be "Bach".

The only actual Bach (or Monteverdi or Dufay) was that one; the fact that part of that whole is now lost probably forever is sad, but it cannot be an excuse, if one is interested in it (which is not a necessity, granted) for not trying to recovering what can be recovered and putting it in practice again (even with all the dangers and the incertitudes of the process).

So, adding a rhythmic section, experimenting with patches and sounds, re-arranging, etc. is totally legitimate (and anybody saying the contrary goes against centuries (millennia?) of musical practice) and may yield valuable results, which however are new results, not the "restitution" of previous results. To put it simply: there is no "modernisation", there is only new music.

Thanks,

M.

In reply to by Miwarre

Hi, Maurizio,
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thanks for your comment. You are right, I am not talking about real facts, I'm talking about a virtual "Paradise Sound Studio in Musicians Heaven" - where great JSB possibly meets other musicians.
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You state: That's not real! Bach died in 1750! And, you are right. I know, sometimes, there is a real danger in any virtual world - you might really get lost in that virtual world. (That should not happen!)
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May I reply with a citation?
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"You may say, I'm a dreamer - but I'm not the only one! (John Lennon, Songtext "Imagine")"
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Well, let me state: The only drugs I use sometimes, are coffeein (regulary and often) and ethanol (seldom (2-3 glasses wine/month). 30 years ago, I once used nicotin (often), but stopped smokin' tobacco completely in 10/1986 - Never any hallucinogenes, never any hard drugs.
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Or , to say it the other way round: Give me Music! "Coffee-House Blues"! I don't need any other "drug".
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Maurizio, I still can tell the difference between "real" and "virtual" world. But, you should see: Johann Sebastian Bach is not really "dead and gone" forever. You still can meet him!
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Just take some work of Bach: BWV 565, Toccata and Fugue d-minor. Take the notes to your Piano, or a church organ, or your PC (with Musescore), and make them "ring".
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Lean back, relax, close your eyes, and listen to > https://musescore.com/classicman/scores/55680
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And a virtual world will pop up in your mind... In this virtual world, you really can meet Johann Sebastian Bach. He will talk to you - just listen to his thoughts, written into some notes on the score.
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But, in any case, it will be your very private virtual world. Others won't see, what you see, and cannot hear, what you hear. So, you are the only director in your private movie!
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So, I am director in my dream, too. I just imagine...
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But we should see the possibility of some strange connection between virtual and real world. Ideas might pop up in virtual world - then leave it and become real.
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Want an example, Maurizio? Computer-Software. Born in virtual world. Left it in form of a drone, armed with atomic warheads, and it's control-systems. A flying killer-robot, now real enough, to kill innocent people in reallity at real time. And this nightmare won't be stopped by the words "This is not real!".
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I said, "Johann Sebastian Bach talked to me in my dream. He likes Jazz, too!" You may say, I'm a dreamer... or may say "That's not real." or "I don't share that dream."
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But: Is it to be called illegal, to talk about a dream of mine? I still think, it's a good idea, to do so. Just to give the contemporaries of mine the possibillity to understand, why. And, might be, some psychiatrist or couch doctor could read this, too and find a way, to help?
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B^))
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Thanks for your positive critics!
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FarrierPete

In reply to by FarrierPete

Well, the criticism part was quit tiny indeed! If it did not seem so, probably I expressed myself poorly (but please be tolerant, I am not an English native speaker).

Musicians have always taken previous material for further exploration and invention. Bach himself did it repeatedly. A melody known in France as Une jeune fillette or Ma belle si ton ame and in Italy as La Monica, has been used by innumerable composers (including Frescobaldi) for vocal pieces, dances, instrumental pieces. Cipriano's madrigal Anchor che col partire got instrumental versions with diminutions, parodies, and so on. A dance tune known in early XVII c. Northern Italy as La Mantovana (or Fuggi fuggi fuggi from one of its most famous setting) has been 'arranged' by several composers, walked its way up to Bohemia and ended up as the main theme of Smetana's Vltava movement of Má Vlast symphonic poem, as a 'typical' Bohemian theme!

So, any further elaboration should be welcome; not everything will please everybody, but this is inevitable (in his own time, Bach was generally respected and appreciated as a great organist and a learned musician, but not all his music appealed to everybody!).

The criticism part was only for the "Bach" label; for two reasons:

a) I believe this to be musicological debatable and

b) don't be shy! this is (also) your work; if you feel that the pre-existant Bah material is a large part of the final result, there is always the double name trick "Bach-FarrierPete" (as in Bach-Busoni works), give it a new title, etc... this (and all the pieces with a similar origin) is new music in its own title, don't hide behind Bach name! ;)

Maurizio

In reply to by Miwarre

Hi again, Maurizio,
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I agree - except one point: "this is (also) your work", as you said...
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No, Sir, it is not! Only, a very, very tiny part could be considered as "Copyright by..."
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Look, what's that "FarrierPete" really added to the score?
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All the notes I really added were two repeat-marks (play it twice) - and one new "final chord" with a "2-Octave-Glissando".
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I've chosen a Mix of "Square Lead/Lead + Bass" (from a Soundfont I did not create) as Instrument. Some Robert Moog and Walter Carlos did something similar before me - I only followed their example.
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Even, the idea to reset it as "Swing" isn't really mine - Others did something similar before me - I only followed their example.
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I added some "Percussion" to the score, brushing on the Hi-Hat and some Backbeats on the Snare... (not very good, as I'm not really a drummer. Should ask some Specialist, how to do the Swing...)
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If I calculate "Who did what?", it will be
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BWV784 Invention No13 (JS_Bach) ________________ 94%
Syncopating (Swing) (var. Ragtime/Jazz composers)_ 3%
New Instrumentation (Synth) (R.Moog/W. Carlos)____ 2%
Arrangement with Percussion (FarrierPete)__________ 1%
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That's the reallity, as I see it. And there is no intent of mine to hide behind a big name.
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Might be, there are some Copyright-Sharks out in the wild that add 2-4 Notes to any score, plus one last "Fermate" and will claim "Arrangement © 2015 by..." Really poor and shabby, like vultures... that smells like "Making money without any effort"... (Join the GEMA or The Richmond Organization, Inc. , guys, to meet some like-minded persons.)
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No, Sir, "That's no way to get along!" (™ by Robert Wilkins). I won't follow that way. Not because I were "shy" - just because I am self confident enough, to tell the fountain, tell the source, where the good water came from.
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It's just because of my respect for the big work, that JSB did. He's the teacher - I'm the scholar, that tries to learn from him. That's all.
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Sincerely
Pete

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