Realistic Finger Cymbal (zills) sf/converting .wav to .sf?

• Nov 29, 2015 - 23:40

I've only recently been introduced to the world of soundfonts so this is all a bit confusing for me.
1. Does anyone know of a decent finger cymbal (zill) soundfont? The default sf on Musescore 2 just uses a horrible triangle noise
2. Is there any way to convert .wav files to soundfonts? I found really good .wav recordings of finger cymbals, and I'd love to just use those.
Help!


Comments

I made my own finger cymbal sound (from the Philharmonia I think).

I would suggest making your own too, or I could upload mine. If you want to made you own, you will need a soundfont editor. I use Polyphone; Viena (only one "n") is also very good. Both of these are free. Polyphone is more user friendly, but Viena is more stable.
After that it gets a lot more complicated. I could message you with a step by step tutorial (I don't feel like going through all the steps here, too long) if you want help. You could also use online sources to learn (that's how I did it)

In reply to by straannick

Step 1. Obtain samples. There are many free/public domain samples. The sample MUST be in .wav format. If you find .mp3/.ogg/.flac/.aiff (etc.), and want to use those, you will have to convert them at some point.

Step 2. Edit the samples. This is easily done in Audacity ( a free program). Cut any silence that comes before the sample or after the sample. Adjust the amplification of the samples so that all samples are the same volume (on audacity, effects-> amplify). You can also do other things here if you choose, such as using a noise eliminator (be careful, this could affect the quality of the sample) or using an IR Reverb plugin in conjunction with Audacity to add reverb (all of these will be found under the effects tab, you will have to set up Audacity to work with your external plugins. VST effect plugins work fine.) You can export to .wav in this step.

Step 3. Load all samples into a soundfont editor (I will use Polyphone in this explanation). Set you root key to the note that you want to have you sample play on (in MIDI, 60=middle C). Loop you sample by clicking on a start point and end point and adjusting your loop until it is smooth (no clicks). The loop will allow the sample to play theoretically indefinably, so do not include the attack or decay in you loop (unless it is a percussion/piano/harpsichord, then loop at some point in the decay). Use the equalizer to limit unwanted noise or adjust the sound of your sample if needed.

Step 4. Create an "instrument" and name the instrument whatever you want. Load all of your samples into the instrument by selection them, right clicking and selecting "bind to instrument". In this stage, add the range you want your samples to play with the "key range" space, and what dynamic levels you want it to play at with the "velocity range" space. You will also have to adjust the "volume envelope release" a bit to make your sound font play smoothly. For the volume envelope step, I suggest you apply it to the "global" (this will adjust all samples).
If you use stereo samples, make sure they are properly panned (left=-50 right=50). There is a lot more you can do here, but since you are just starting, that is all I would worry about.

Step.5 Create a Preset and name it whatever you want. Add your instrument to the preset by selecting it, right clicking and selecting "bind to preset". After this you are done. Once again, there is a lot you can do in this menu, but I would not worry about it since you are just starting.

Save your soundfont and you are done.
EDIT: while this may seem simple, it actually takes a couple days to a couple months to complete this process (depending on how many presets and samples are involved) if you want a precise, clean and realistic soundfont. Just be aware when you start a project, it will not be a quick finish.

In reply to by [DELETED] 597046

Thank you for an excellent description. It should be placed in the Handbook, as well as it would be good to make a separate topic on the forum.
I also try to use Audacity and Polyphone similar way. I need to make a SFZ soundfont with specific historical bells sounds. And for the slow tempo and playing note by note it turns out well - just like in reality. But if play, for example, sixteenth notes at a fast tempo and a few notes at a time, the sound is harsh, tinny and irrelevant to reality. In the attached example the first three measures at a tempo of 40 sound good, but at a tempo of 120 sound is terrible.
Q1. Could you recommend some Polyphone instrument parameter settings for the solution of this problem?
Q2. Is it possible that bad sound is a result of some specific of Zerberus implementation in MuseScore?
Q3. Is it possible to listen results of soundfont instrument settings in polyphone? I have not found such an opportunity, and therefore I'm forced to export sfz and listen it in MuseScore after every correction, which is inconvenient.

Attachment Size
Bells sample.JPG 84.45 KB
Bells sfz sample (mp3).zip 670.47 KB

In reply to by straannick

It is not a good idea to use Polyphone to edit SFZ.

There is a big difference between SF2 and SFZ in that SFZ is a completely open format consisting of a folder of samples and text file containing instructions on how to play them.

SF2 is monolithic in that it packages up the samples into one package along with the various controls required to play them.

It is very unusual to be able to play an SF2 converted to SFZ without further editing.

You also need to bear in mind that Zerberus only implements a subset of SFZ opcodes, and Polyphone may be exporting opcodes it doesn't recognise.

Also - how many bell samples are you using for the soundfont? If there are too few, then the time-stretching involved in playing the pitches may result in tonal alterations to the sound.

HTH

In reply to by ChurchOrganist

Thank you, ChurchOrganist!
As I understand Polyphone does NOT convert sf2 to sfz, but just export in one folder samples and in text file - opcodes for samples tuning. No more.
But anyway, if we have a goal to get realistic sound in MuseScore with sfz, we
a) should understand which sfz parameters Zerberus understand and
b) use right tools for sfz creation

Can you answer for this two questions? Can you, or somebody else, describe Zerberus subset of SFZ opcodes and recommend right tool for sfz creation and sound control (of course, differs from text editor :-) ?

About my case. I use special notation technique when one specific bell reside on specific line, look picture, please - bell #1, #2 and so one. And I have exact correspondence: one note <-> one sample, so any alterations are impossible. For example, bell #1 is not a D-38 note, but just a "sample of bell #1". For my example there are 11 samples of 11 bells for 11 notes. And I don't need other notes because no other bells on the belfry! All others notes in my sfz have "specific sound" which means "error in notation". So I need to create special "instrument" for special belfry for sound authenticity.

In reply to by straannick

You can find the list of Opcodes Zerberus supports here......
https://github.com/musescore/MuseScore/blob/3f94d879dd33f9b862aa9b16303…

This is direct from the MuseScore source code, and I have in fact extracted the list and put it into a text file, but I do not have time to find it and upload it as I have to leave for a gig in 15 mins.

Most people edit SFZ with a text editor. I don't know which OS you are using but there is an application called sfZed for Windows which is a good starting point, but you will need a copy of RGC Audio's SFZ player, for which the links to download at Cakewalk are now broken. The drawback is that it only supports SFZ format 1 which is exclusive to the RGC SFZ player.

Probably the best bet is for you to use the Plogue sforzando player which uses the Aria engine. The procedure is to use syntax highlighting in your text editor to show up the opcodes - you can find definitions for Notepad++ here.....
https://musescore.org/en/node/99411

OK must run - more later.

In reply to by ChurchOrganist

OK as promised attached is a list of opcodes supported by Zerberus, together with a list of those that aren't :)

When I compiled this I was under the erroneous impression that SFZ 1.0 was the standard format.

This has turned out not to be the case, however.

I strongly recommend that you get hold of and read Simon Cann's book Cakewalk Synthesisers From Presets to Power Users, which, as far as I know is the only source for the complete list of SFZ opcodes, together with notes on their use, although even there the Plogue opcode extensions are missing.

All online sources are currently incomplete.

I am only just starting to get to grips with this format myself, but I have already discovered, as I mentioned before, that the way forward is to use a text editor (preferably with opcode highlighting) together with a player such as Plogue's Sforzando to test the result.

You simply save the edited SFZ file and then (re)import into Sforzando to hear the result.

HTH

Attachment Size
MuseScoreSFZopcodes.txt 4.57 KB

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