Certain objects drag in surprising ways

• Oct 25, 2020 - 07:30

Musescore 3.5 / Mac OS

Generally MuseScore drags the score in response to a click-drag event. If I create a new score generally everything is battened down. MuseScore drags the score when I click and drag:

  • a measure
  • a bar line
  • a key signature
  • a measure
  • the interstitial space between staves or between systems
  • a line break
    ... essentially all non-note objects.

Given this contest it's odd that the Meter object is a loose canon. I can drag it outside the staff, even where it appears to be associated with a staff or system below. Is this a bug or am I missing something of value here? I can also drag the Meter rightward beyond notes, but on mouseUp MuseScore sends all the notes to its right—even if this is deemed valuable I'd think Meter.y would not track mouse.y

Also odd that (on drag) a full measure rest MuseScore does not drag the score. It just selects the object and does not drag it either, neither in x or y.

When I click a Note:

  • MusceScore intelligently constrains the pitch if I drag rightward
  • MusceScore intelligently constrains note.x if I drage the note vertically to change pitch

But with Rests we don't see these note-drag behaviors. Rather Rests share some of the Meter-drag oddities—and they are freewheeling both in x and y. I think it would make more sense if rests dragged like notes.

scorster

Comments

• Oct 25, 2020 - 13:26

The items you describe that cannot be dragged individually are usually fixed in their locations. Like clefs are always at the beginning of a staff, so dragging that doesn't move it. You must make a concerted effort to change their location by adjusting an offset in the inspector. These are safeguards against accidentally dragging fixed items.

Things like Tempo text can easily be moved around because sometimes you don't really want a system text above it but rather below it. You may want it to the right of a rehearsal mark rather than above it. All of these are easy to move either by dragging them or using the inspector.

Notes usually have a fixed position on the staff as well. Dragging is a mouse method for changing the pitch of a note so you don't normally want to change its horizontal location on the staff. Once again, you can use the inspector to move it if that's what you really want. BTW, if you double click the note you can drag it horizontally and vertically without changing the pitch. Some people do this by accident and aren't happy with the results.

Rests are given a bit more flexibility and probably too much flexibility to be moved by the mouse in my opinion but you can move them up and down easily. This allows you to easily prevent them from overlapping cross staff items they don't know to avoid (which should be fixed) or to just give them a more logical location on the staff. For example, I've seen piano music with notes in voice 2 5 ledger lines below the staff and the rests default to being on the bottom line of the staff. In my opinion this doesn't look good, so I move the rests down to be between the notes.

In conclusion, there was definite thought that went into the design of what can and cannot be dragged.

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• Oct 25, 2020 - 17:46

Hi Mike,

Thanks for your reply.

> The items you describe that cannot be dragged individually are usually fixed in their locations. Like clefs are always at the beginning of a staff, so dragging that doesn't move it. You must make a concerted effort to change their location by adjusting an offset in the inspector. These are safeguards against accidentally dragging fixed items.

Correct. I'm not contesting MuseScore built-in safeguard against accidentally dragging certain items, for instance, those like clefs, key signature. And this leads back to my opening inquiry: "Why is Meter not similarly fixed it its location and immune to dragging?"

> Notes usually have a fixed position on the staff as well. Dragging is a mouse method for changing the pitch of a note so you don't normally want to change its horizontal location on the staff.

Yes, exactly as I described. But more clearly:

  • Once the user commences note pitch drag we have a) free control over y with notes snapping to successively to lines and space; b) cursor.x does not commute to note.x, As mentioned this constraint makes perfect sense. However if the user first moves the cursor rightward MuseScore moves the note rightward logically ignoring any change in mouse.y If the user first attempts to drag a note leftward, mouse.x and mouse.y are ignored. (Side notes: I've always wondered why we have to go into edit mode to move a note leftward.)

> Rests are given a bit more flexibility and probably too much flexibility to be moved by the mouse in my opinion but you can move them up and down easily. This allows you to easily prevent them from overlapping cross staff items they don't know to avoid (which should be fixed) or to just give them a more logical location on the staff.

Agreed. This underscores my second question. In MuseScore why are Rest drags inherently slipperier than note drags? I'd think parallel UI on Note and Rest drags would be appropriate. That was my singular point on this topic. If I drag a rest initially in x I expect y constrained (unless I'm in Edit mode). If I drag a rest initially in y (pitch) I expect y would snap to lines and spaces and x constrained . Just like with notes.

With regard to your point about the need to afford precise Rest locationing (so users can manually address Rest collisions with various objects) there's the freewheeling Edit mode (double click) or the Inspector.

I'd really like to see matching Note and Rest drag behaviors.

scorster

Reply

• Oct 26, 2020 - 00:43

Then we're back to the points I made in my first two paragraphs:

  • Elements like clefs and key signatures are fixed with regard to a normal drag.
  • Whereas Meter (time signature) is not fixed against a normal drag and moves freely in both x and y coordinates. At least, as originally stated, that's true here in MuseScore 3.5 on MacOS.

My reason for posting was to question why Meter is not fixed like Clefs and Key signatures. Sorry if I was unclear.

...

I also opined that it's oddly counterintuitive Notes and Rests have distinctly different drag behaviors, unless there's some distinct advantage to that.

scorster

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• Oct 26, 2020 - 02:04

I never noticed time signatures would drag as a group like that. It may be related to the fact that you can make large time signatures that you see in 20th century music. These usually appear between staves. It's also possible to have a single digit time signature and you may need to adjust the time signature for all staves the same amount at once.

I told you that in my opinion you can move rests too much by dragging them, they should be more limited to remain on the same beat they appear but up and down like notes is understandable. Notes change pitch when dragged. This is part of the mouse note input interface. I don't use it but many people prefer that over the keyboard, probably because they don't type.

BTW, I'm just another user like you. If you want to know how to do most things not related to Midi I can probably handle it though I do learn new things like the draggable time signatures from time to time. Other than that I mostly speculate as to the logic of what the program can do.

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