Different play transposition for the same stave in the different parts not managed correctly
MuseScore let the possibility to have different play transposition for the same slave in the different parts, but it is not managed correctly.
//musescore.org/sites/musescore.org/files/Essai_8.mscz
In the score bellow, in D minor, I changed the play transposition for the accordion part to have it in A minor (the play transposition is perfect forth). This one is not changed in the conductor part (the play transposition is perfect unison).
I don’t understand how I can have different interval between the different notes according the part and the concert pitch option.
Accordion in the conductor:
- Play pitch: C (one line bellow) A (one line over). Interval: 12.
- Concert pitch: F (first space), D (line four). Interval: 5.
Accordion in its part:
- Play pitch: C (one line bellow) A (second space). Interval: 5.
- Concert pitch: F (first space), D (line four). Interval: 5.
The correct interval is 5 and not 12.
| Attachment | Size |
|---|---|
| Essai.mscz | 9.58 KB |
| Accordion in the conductor.png | 8.33 KB |
| Accordion in its own part.png | 3.91 KB |
| Accordion in the conductor-Concert pitch.png | 8.22 KB |
Comments
You have somehow put a different instrument into the conductor's score than is extracted. The extracted accordion is a transposing instrument while the one in the conductor's score is not. More than likely you extracted parts, then deleted and reentered or otherwise redefined one of the accordions.
MuseScore should reflect the same instrumentation in both conductor's score and extracted parts. My guess is that you extracted parts, deleted the accordion (or redefined it) while in the conductor's score then reentered the score, but I'm not sure.
I can see the different definitions for the instruments by right clicking the line and selecting staff properties. The transpositions are different.
In reply to You have somehow put a by mike320
I didn't do so complicate things, as it is possible, I changed the play transposition to perfect forth in the accordion part. I didn't changed anything in the conductor.
Also the instruments should be identical in both parts.
In reply to I didn't do so complicate by BertrandW
The accordion in the conductor's part is in a different key that the one in the extracted part. It doesn't do that on its own.
How did you transpose it to A minor. Please tell me your steps. I believe that is where the problem arose.
In reply to The accordion in the by mike320
Changing the play transposition as indicated below in the accordion part changes the key displayed in this part:
![Edit Stave-Part Properties.png]( "Edit Stave-Part Properties.png")
In the accordion part, I want to manage the instrument as a transposing instrument (to play a F when a C is displayed). Because of this, the key need to be changed. This is working perfectly and the key is changed as it should.
Also, simply changing the play transposition changes the key as expected.
But as I am not interested by this in the conductor part, I didn't do anything in this part.
That is the problem. As the instrument is not transposing, the key is correct, but not the notes. The most strange is the second note as it is displayed as if the instrument is considered as transposing but not at the correct octave.
To be sure to be understood, I did this modification after the notes were written and it is this unique modification that make problems.
Everything is in order if I put back the play transposition to perfect unison in the accordion part so that the both part have the same transposing rule.
In reply to Changing the play by BertrandW
I suspected as much. You actually redefined the instrument rather than transposing the measure in the song. To transpose the measure, select the lines you want transposed and from the menu select notes->transpose... then check "by key" and uncheck "Tranpose Key signatures" and select the new key for the notes and the notes will change accordingly.
In reply to I suspected as much. You by mike320
I used the play transposition fields because it is what I wanted.
Unfortunately, as this tool is implemented, it let suppose that it is possible to have different values according the part, but it is not working.
I could be nice:
In reply to I used the play transposition by BertrandW
I guess transposing should be linked between score and part. So if you transpose in part, score transposes too and vice versa. To see the ínstrument transposed or not is what the concert pitch setting is for, this is (and should not be) linked between part and score, so can get set individually.
In reply to Changing the play by BertrandW
I'm not sure of your last edit, I just had a notification you did something, so I don't remember what you added to your previous post. Having said that. If you have not already fixed it as I suggested because your part has a redefined instrument, your best bet might be it insert a new accordion with the notes you want, use my transposition instructions and delete the redefined redefined, otherwise you may forget to change something back and we'll be here trying to figure out what that is.
In reply to I'm not sure of your last by mike320
The change you miss is cosmetic: It is the correction of a spelling mistake...
I don't want to change the notes. What I want is:
Is it possible to have such score?
I don't understand that I can change the properties of the stave and make them different in each part if then the score becomes wrong.
In reply to The change you miss is by BertrandW
The accordion is non transposing. That means an A4 on the piano is an A4 on the accordion. To put a different note on the conductor's score than on the instrument part does not make sense. The conductor is supposed to see what everyone is playing. If the accordion is playing C and A the conductor's score should always show it or he will chastise the accordion player for playing the wrong note.
The fact you can change the instrument in the part and it not affect the score is a bug that needs to be squashed to prevent this conversation from happening with anyone else.
In reply to The accordion is non by mike320
There are different accordions, like A-D, C-F that can be considered as transposing instrument:
To be able to play on a C-F like on a G-C, you need to transpose the stave.
Of course, as there is no standard keyboard for altered notes, there may still be some work for the notes that are not in the scale.
The soft will be more clear if changing the instrument in the part also affect the score and all the other parts in which it can be included.
Thank you for the time spent clarifying this.
In reply to There are different by BertrandW
Since I'm not familiar with this concept help me understand and I might be able to help you do what you want to do.
Let's use the A-D accordion (which seems to be the one you are working with right now). How does the musician change from A to D as the key for the accordion. Apparently, you are pressing a certain key at one point and getting one note then getting another note at a different time. This seems to be the only way what you are trying to do makes sense to me.
In reply to There are different by BertrandW
Diatonic accordion? (playing with buttons)
Melodeon or Garmon?
In reply to Diatonic accordion? (playing by Ziya Mete Demircan
Yes, it is a diatonic, not a A-D but a C-F.
This two examples of accordion keyboard, one G-C and one C-F:
![Accordion - Example of G-C and C-F keyboards.png]( "Accordion - Example of G-C and C-F keyboards.png")
The left row is mainly standard, bu not the right one or the third row when there is one.
For the notes in the yellow area (the standard scale from C to C in the G-C accordion), there is this correspondence:
It is really like a transposing instrument:
You play a A minor on a G-C nearly the same way you play a D minor on a C-F (I didn't check for the altered notes not in the scale on the two examples above).
In reply to Yes, it is a diatonic, not a by BertrandW
Basically you are trying to write it for one accordion on the conductor's score and have a different accordion on the extracted part. I would say the easiest way to do that is to add the second accordion (that will later be extracted into a part), adjust it's transposition, then copy the notes from the original accordion to the second one. Open instruments and uncheck visible for the second accordion. You can then extract the part for the second accordion. This will leave it visible the way you want. Just remember to copy any changes to the conductor's score to the extracted part (and visa versa) once you do that, so they will be the same.
I wish you could link 2 different instrument staffs so this could be automated, but that is not possible.