leading space

• Jan 23, 2019 - 20:03

Would be really useful in this situation: leading space.png

to put some breathing room between the rehearsal mark and the C. Right now, there is no way I know of to really fix this - stretching the measure looks funky.

It's on a part, so I'm not doing any invisible staff shenanigans for a minor layout annoyance.


My workaround is to either put an unnecessary accidental, key signature or time signature in that staff only and make it invisible to make some room.

I agree, the workaround shouldn't be necessary.

In reply to by mike320

I don't have my computer handy to test right now, but I thought by the title of the thread the implication was that the leading space setting in the Inspector is somehow not working correctly. It worked fine for me when I tried it though. Are we actually talking about increasing the default if a rehearsal mark is present? Maybe only if the first note is above the staff? to me it would be more sensible to adjust the rehearsal mark but keep the note where it belongs.

In reply to by Marc Sabatella

Rehearsal marks are always supposed to be centered over the barline. Only exception is at the beginning of a system. It's the note that needs to move, not the rehearsal mark. I think we had a discussion on an issue about auto placing rehearsal marks, actually.

And from other comments on the thread... are you saying there is a place to adjust leading space? Because I can't find it - thought it was removed in MS3.

In reply to by Laurelin

I believe Gould explicitly recommends moving rehearsal marks if necessary to avoid issues, and I certainly see that often in published music.

Meanwhile, the segment leading space in the Inspector (select the first note of the measure) should work just fine for adding extra space before the first note if you want.

So, just messing around, and the issue comes up again, except now I want trailing space as well, and while I've found the leading space, I don't see a trailing space.
The original:
and MS3:
trailing space.png

The reason why it's like that in the original is to save space, paper and ink. I pulled the image off of the New York Philharmonic Archives, if you're wondering.

Thinking about it, what I would like is more style options. If I can have a formatting options that aligns the Rehearsal Mark above the barline every time, I could check that and be happy. If I could also have an option that creates room around said RM, that would also be really good. I think that if the answer is 'sometimes x' and 'sometimes y' then there should be options for both.

Although really, RMs are never not above the barline unless you count the beginning of a system.

In reply to by Laurelin

Trailing space is indeed gone, the algorithm doesn't use that anymore apparently. So instead, use leading space on the barline. Except, it will get lost on save/reload, see #139846: Leading space adjustment for generated elements lost on save/reload.

Not sure what you mean about rehearsal marks - aren't they aligned over the barline every time? If you mean, you want them to be at a fixed vertical position and thus extra space allocated to either side so they don't need to be pushed higher, the way I think would make the most sense is to add "padding" or "margin" (we use the terms inconsistently) around the outside of the text frame.

In reply to by Marc Sabatella

They are not aligned over the barline everytime. Maybe 40% of the time. If the barline is anything except a plain single line, it's not aligned. If the RM itself is too wide(M, two digit numbers) or too thin (1, I) it isn't aligned.

The reason, as far as I can tell, is because the RM is attached to the first note of a measure, not the barline. If it could be attached to the barline, and have an option for the notes to move horizontally to accommodate a rehearsal note, that will solve some issues with them needing to be absurdly high to dodge high notes + articulations sometimes. The padding would work, so if you wanted it to dodge notes entirely, you could and the notes would ignore it's existence, but you could also drag it back down if you were dealing with, say, a flute part and didn't want to have a full inch of space.

In reply to by Laurelin

Real examples would help. For me, it's always directly over the barline - the layout algorithm specifically makes this so, even though the mark is attached to the note. The only exception is for start repeats, which could be deliberate (someone may have requested this at some point) or could be a faulty calculation of where the beginning of the bar is when start repeat is present.

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