Is there a way to do this...

• Feb 7, 2020 - 06:05

...without using "fancy tricks" like hiding rests?


Also, is there a way to enter in the "2 ped." marking so that it is performed that way? (I'm not a pianist, but I assume it means that two pedals are used so that all notes are sustinato? I further assume that there may be something in the Inspector I can adjust for this to be performed correctly, but I do not know what that is nor to what value it should be set.)


Read about cross-staff notation:

But you will still have to hide a rest on the lower piano staff:
Cross-staff notation in MuseScore.png

As regards the 2 ped. mark, I would use ordinary staff text set to display below the staff. And I would use hidden "Ped." lines to implement the sustain effect. As far as I know, there is no way in MuseScore to mimic the sostenuto effect for a single note i.e. the use of the middle pedal on a piano.

In reply to by OlyDLG

You will find the "Ped." lines in the Lines palette:
Pedal notation in MuseScore.png

If you select the starting note for the Ped. line and double-click the Ped. line in the palette, MuseScore will extend the line automatically to fill the measure. There are two ways to limit the Ped. line to less than a whole measure:
a) before placing the Ped.line: select starting note, then Ctrl+click the ending note, then double-click the Ped. line in the palette (see highlighted notes in image above)
b) after the Ped. line has filled the whole measure: double-click the Ped. line in the score, then Shift+Left arrow to move the end anchor point

Do not try to move any anchor point by dragging it! You may get the desired visual effect, but the pedal playback will be wrong... You should only use Shift+Left arrow or Shift+Right arrow.

[EDIT] For a fine example of multiple pedal marks per measure, see this song by Augusta Holmès in the OpenScore Lieder Corpus:

In reply to by DanielR

OK, after some research, I've determined that:
1) the playback effect of any of the pedal lines is intended to simulate the effect of the sustain pedal;
2) presently, there is no "easy" way to simulate the effect of the una corda pedal (or the sostenuto pedal for that matter);
Is that correct?
Assuming yes: any recommendations for "hard" ways to simulate the effect of the una corda pedal? (Thank goodness I don't need the sostenuto pedal as well!)
Thanks again!

In reply to by OlyDLG

"any recommendations for "hard" ways to simulate the effect of the una corda pedal?
I don't see it as "hard": for una corda I usually set a p or pp dynamic and make it invisible, and add a text below the stave as "una corda".

But as discussed, the sostenuto pedal is not implemented for playback yet.

In reply to by OlyDLG

"Una corda" means one string, and the effect of the una corda pedal is to shift the hammers so that they strike only one string of each note. So a pp played on a single string per note will sound different from a pp played on multiple strings per note. But AFAIK there are no samples of una corda in the soundfont supplied with MuseScore.

In reply to by OlyDLG

You can probably simulate sostenuto playback by creating a second, hidden, piano instrument for just the sostenuto notes (and using a regular pedal for them), and then silencing the corresponding visible notes on the main piano instrument.

Depending on how much sostenuto content you have, this could be a huge pain to do, but theoretically possible.

In reply to by OlyDLG

The first piano is the one that's visible. It plays all of the notes except for the sostenuto ones that have been individually silenced. It also contains fake sostenuto markings that are just for show.

The second piano is invisible. It plays copies of all of the sostenuto notes that have been silenced in the first piano. It also contains functional pedal markings that cause the “sostenuto” notes to be sustained without affecting the notes in the first piano.

I've just made and attached a short demonstration piece for you to study.

Attachment Size
Sostenuto Demo.mscz 8.59 KB

In reply to by Spire42

Please remind me what I have to do to see hidden things in another person's score.

But regardless: why do you need to have a second piano, i.e., can't you do in the first piano part whatever you do to them in the second piano part? If not why not?

In reply to by OlyDLG

Oh, and now I think I see the answer to the other Q as well: basically, you want sostenuto to apply only to the first beat--and last for three beats--but not to the notes played in the two beats which follow, which you can't presently do in MS w/ only one piano part, because the way it's set up, if you indicate sustain for three beats, it will sustain all the notes played during those three beats, yes? I assume you tried your workaround using multiple voices in a single piano part, i.e., entering the sostenuto beat in voice one and the non-sostenuto beats in voice 2 (and that didn't work)?

Assuming that's correct, that's actually a really ingenious solution: nice work!

In reply to by OlyDLG

A sostenuto pedal affects only the notes that are being held down at the moment the pedal is initially depressed.

MuseScore cannot play a proper sostenuto effect; it can only do a regular damper effect that sustains all the notes that are played for as long as the pedal is being depressed.

To simulate a sostenuto effect if all we have is a damper pedal that sustains all the notes, we can use two pianos: one to play only the regular unsustained notes and another one to play only the sustained notes.

Fortunately for us, we don't actually need to buy two pianos. All we need is MuseScore, which can create two virtual pianos for us, free of charge. Because we're trying to pretend that we have only one piano, we hide the second one, even though we can hear the sustained notes that it's playing. We also silence the corresponding notes for the first piano, because we don't want to hear two of the same note.

In reply to by Spire42

Right, part of the problem was that I didn't fully understand the sostenuto pedal effect--thanks for that additional clarification: it all makes a lot more sense now. Since you're so ingenious ;-) any ideas as to how to simulate the una corda pedal effect?

In reply to by OlyDLG

I would go with DanielR's suggestion to use hidden dynamics markings.

Or, if I were being really picky, I'd set up the una corda section(s) of the piece to use a SoundFont or VST that has dedicated una corda samples. This wouldn't work if I intended to share the score, though.

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