different barlines in different staffs

• Aug 23, 2015 - 11:56

dear all,

is there a better/meant way of doing what i want?
(1st. bars 2nd. system)
I unticked ¨visible¨ in the inspector but i would need a normal barline after the upbeat in voice 1(2nd.staff)

Thank you!

Attachment Size
Schots_14.mscz 27.16 KB


I don't understand why you are trying to do this - it looks non-standard and wrong. Instead, you should simply have the the pickup in the middle staff repeated one the last beat before the repeat - in place of the rest you made invisible. Then have the repeats all align as the usual rules of music notation dictate.

In reply to by Marc Sabatella

thank you.

@ Shoichi: how did you do that?

Do you actually drag and drop the ¨short 2 span¨ barline onto the ¨start repeat¨ barline?
It does not work for me: if i do that the ¨start repeat¨ just gets shorter...
If i copy your barline onto it the ¨start repeat¨ disapears.

In reply to by aeLiXihr

I opened your score;
Dragged from the palette to the note and released;
Double-click. With the handle I adjusted;
Wiew, I deselected Show invisible;
I opened Inspector and adjusted the horizontal offset;
Done. Here, on Vista, it works but consider what Marc said.
I hope I explained (at least with the attachment), buona musica!

Attachment Size
steps.pdf 124.55 KB

In reply to by Shoichi

hey, thank you very much! I will keep that for future reference :)
I had been trying dragging to the barline.
That helps: dragging to the note it worked.

Why did you use the short 2 span barline, i could ¨drag in¨ the normal barline as well. (so no need for making it wider)

In reply to by Shoichi

okay Shoichi, thanks again!

I have been trying a bit and there are 2 reasons for which i rather not use this workaround.
-it is a bit of a cheat since one cannot attach the line to the note it belongs to, but the one before(or after, it will not ¨stick¨ to the 1st. note in the bar).
-doing so, the note spacing is (slightly) affected, ruining a layout on a tight score.

BUT, i do like the idea of attaching a line to a note and dragging to the right position.
So i tried two things:

line>line(the prelast one, above ambitus) drag to make vertical in the right lenght to fit the staff.
The line looks good but cannot be copied.(i think) So one would have to fit the line everytime again.

And i tried a ¨|¨ symbol in staff text.
The symbol can be copied but looks no good (too short).

That leaves two questions:
-is there a way to copy lines
-is there a way to add/copy,edit a symbol

Thank you!

Attachment Size
Schots_14.mscz 27.52 KB

In reply to by Marc Sabatella

...i am only interested in finding out if software lets me write my music the way i wish.
The 1st. voice starts with the upbeat and the accompanyment starts one beat later...
I am not concerned about if it fits your standard or not.

Just for the record: i used line>line, ticked ¨allow vertical¨ and dragged in place.

Attachment Size
Schots_14.mscz 27.68 KB

In reply to by aeLiXihr

It's not "my standard" - standards for music notation are univeersal. There is a very simple universally-standard way to write repeats, and I can't see any reason not to use them. could you perhaps explain further?

EDIT: the reason I keep pointing this is otu is that if MsueScore is designed to support standard music notation, andif you use repeats as they are used in standard music notation, you don't need any orkarounds at all - no complicated no multi-step process to insert them, no manual adjustments needed, playback works perfectly right out of the box, etc. Standard music notation would do everything you need it to do and be more readable to musicians accustomed to standard music notation.

There are highly unusual situations where it can occasional be necessary for some specific reason to violate the standard to express some particular musical idea that does not fit into standard notation, but I don't see how that applies here - what you are trying to do appears to fit perfectly in standard notation, and is the sort of the thing people have notated in the standard way for centuries. Unless there is something unusual about your intent that is not obvious from the music, and that's what I am trying to understand here.

If that is the case - if you truly are trying to create some non-standard effect that *cannot* be represented in standard notation - it would help if you explain what that non-standard effect is. Then we could better advise you how to create it.

In reply to by Marc Sabatella

Hi Marc,
thanks for your input!
I do not quite understand what the buzz is about.
If you look at the .pdf everything between the ¨repeat¨-barlines is repeated: appears pretty standard to me...

During my studies i read quite some theory books, seeing that about *every* editor does things a bit differently.
It is not like there is some DiN or cen-cenelec for music notation and that makes sense too: every style of music requires its small and sometimes bigger differences.
For example the chord thingy we have been discussing before: How many ways for a b-minor chord with a major 7th did you come across?
BmMa7 BmM7 Bm+7 B-∆ b∆ bm∆ h♯7 Hm∆ and, i learned recently, Bm7M
There are probably(likely?) even more...

Ergo: a universal standard for music notation is mainly in your minds eye.

In this particular exemple with the ¨repeat¨-barlines one could(probably) argue about the one count shift.., but i will not.
The way i wrote it, the phrase is in one shape on one line with nothing written double.
It looks clean and i like it, have been doing this *for ever*, it is perfectly clear what should be played and noone ever complained.
Sibelius let me do that: one could just drag a ¨repeat-barline¨(from a symbol palette iirc) onto the staff, job done...
So that was all my question was about: how is the easiest way of accomplishing this in MS?
I used line>line and it works fine, it would save time if one could copy those lines but since that seems impossible, i will just redraw them :)
Have a nice weekend!

Attachment Size
Schots_14.pdf 63.91 KB

In reply to by aeLiXihr

Yes, there are differences in certain details here and there, but that does not mean there are not standards. There *are* standards for music notation, and MuseScore tries to make it easy to create standard music notation. If you wish to create non-standard notation, you generally can, but it will indeed take extra steps. It is up to you to determine if the gains you feel you get are worth it. I don't see it here - the standard notation would have been considerably simpler not just to create but to read as well.

EDIT: for example, here is a version that preserves the combined 2nd & 4th ending from the first system (using a parenthesized expression to denote the difference), but eliminates the need for the non-aligned repeat signs.

Attachment Size
Schots_14.mscz 29.24 KB

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