STILL, Lost all Work!

• May 7, 2014 - 14:31

WinXP. ver1.3. for background reference my post of May 3. ‘Lost all Work' In this process I found in
Documents/my Musescore folder/this project folder a file with the right name and approx. file size of my lost work.
(No, it is not a backup file, at least as described in the handbook... it had . in front of the name, but no , after) I renamed the file, but to no effect. My other 1c file is in the folder, as well as several pieces/parts of files the program has made up. These files are all saved in ‘Compressed Musescore file' format. When I try to open the file I think is my lost file, Windows sounds its 'doom' chord and then pops a box saying 'can't open file, file extension "mscz, " not supported. The file is not Compressed Musescore. It has my file name.mscz and below it is MSCZ,File. Windows suggests Muscore to open the file, but with no success. What gives? How does a program save a file in a form it can not open? In looking in the hidden files, I found this was not the only time the program saved in this format. So I have beleive others also have some extra files saved the same way. I can rename a file, but no one working in a notation program should have to deal with this!!

Am I just to be teased with the file I need sitting in the folder, but unable to open it?

So, is there anyone working on this program that knows how it 'works' and cares about the people using it for their work.

I honestly do know whether to hold out any hope or not. Any help will be gratefully appreciated!


In reply to by Shoichi

In my small way:
I opened my score;
I waited for a few minutes;
I closed MuseScore.
I opened the folder of my scores (named "Musescoremiei") and I find two files:
As you can see in the attached image the name is the same, the size too, the format (type) changes.
In the Preferences tab, you can see the set time for automatic backups.
(please, keep us informed of the results)

Attachment Size
backups.png 77.31 KB

In reply to by Shoichi

Shoichi, thanks for your comment. You are the first to have the same thing happen. You also show in your post the MSCZ, File I have been mentioning. I will see if I can follow what you have described. I can only say I have opened and closed musescore several times since my problem and I have yet to be so lucky. Heres hoping the next time will be different. I hope others will look at your post and see sort of what I have been trying to describe, poorly. Thanks again, gratefully appreciated!!

In reply to by R.F.

Yes, his screenshot shows exactly what we have been telling you you should see - the normal version of the file with no period or comma, and the backup version that has both period *and* comma. If you rename the latter version to remove the comma, it *will* open If it doesn't, then you you failed to rename it properly.

In reply to by Shoichi

Spes Ultima. Thanks for the thoughts. Had already received that message. Opened the folder and there was no backup made within 3 weeks. The file included pieces/parts of files from the last few months of working, but no copy of anything like my file that was lost. Thanks again!

It's not clear from your description what is happening. Can you list the *exact* name of the folder you are are in, the *exact* contents of it (perhaps by posting a screenshot of Explorer in that Window) and then say *exactly* which file you are attempting to open - ideally, post that file here too.

Also, if you are looking in Documents, you are not looking where it was suggested you look. The autosave versions of you work are not there - they are in "C:\Documents and Settings\yourname\Application Date\MuseE\MuseScore. But the file beginning with a period and ending with a comma in the same folder as your original score is indeed the backup version created the last time you opened a score. Depending on exactly what happened - and from your description it is still not clear - either could potentially be useful.

You should know there is no difference whatsoever between ".mscz" and "mscz," files. MuseScore just adds the comma to backup files it creates, so you don't accidentally open one by mistake thinking it is the real version of a file. But all you have to do it rename it to remove the comma and it should open fine. Autosave versions do not get the comma because there is little danger of someone making that mistake - the files are stored somewhere you have to go out of your way to find.

Do be sure you don't use the Windows option that hides extensions for known files. Second worst thing Microsoft ever did was create that option, worst was make it the default. With that option on, you are not being told the true filenames of any your files. If you don't see MuseScore files ending in ".mscz" or Microsoft Word documents ending in ".doc", you have not turned that option off. That should be the first thing you do before confusing the situation any further. It's a general Windows thing, and it's been a long time since I've used XP; you'll have to do a search to find instructions on how to turn it off.

BTW, instead of starting a new thread, it would have been to have simply posted a reply to your old thread. which had additional information that could be referenced by people trying to help (as well by you looking for previous responses).

In reply to by Marc Sabatella

R.F., I'm not on the MuseScore team, but I am a programmer. Please backup (make a separate copy of) any folder before you change anything during this recovery attempt. So before you take a file called ".xyz.mscz," and screw around with it, like changing the name, or loading it, please backup the whole folder it occurs in. Sorry you lost your work. I know the feeling, so now I backup every hour or so whenever I work on anything...

In reply to by MikeN

Mike N.
Sorry I have not responded sooner, trying to calm down from some comments. Yours was probably the wisest. Backups are always a good idea. I did backup before working any of the thoughts presented.
I can only say my issue happened wile I was saving, so how really safe? Previous to this issue, I lost 6-8 hours work, a saved and closed file, while trying to get rid of some of the pieces/parts files this program saves. Check that, not saved files, just files it creates in the `recent opened` dropdown. It wiped my file, but did keep its made-up file I was trying to erase. Oh well.

Thanks again for your considered thoughts.

In reply to by Marc Sabatella

Marc, thanks for answering. This format is no easy to convey everything. I had tried what Spes had suggested. Check my reply. You may need to check my May 3 post for background. I do not know how to say what the file is more clearly. The lost file was the total saved movement. I had to work in one file, then save to the other. This is all in the
May 3 post, 'Lost all Work'. I am sorry to say there is some difference between .mscz and MSCZ,File. The latter will not open in musescore. I can not believe that others do not have some of these same files saved in their backups, because when I looked in the hidden files there were others there as well as the 'musescore compressed'. It has a different file icon,besides. My post does not show up well, but the file I am finding in 'my' documents (as described above post) has the (.) in front but does not have a (,) following. Below the file name where format is shown is. MSCZ, File . I should say had, as I did try to rename the file, as everyone is suggesting. BUT, it is still in that MSCZ, File. format and musescore will not open it. Sorry about the new thread l
I did not know how to proceed. I hope this clears things slightly. I do not understand why knowing what is in the file makes a difference. It is music, obviously. It is over 80 hours of work. As to what happen exactly my May 3 post describes best what I was doing when things went bad, again. Thanks again for responding. Hope you have something further, I really would like to open that file!

In reply to by R.F.

.mscz, files indeed won't open in MuseScore, that's why you've been tole to rename them to .mscz, i.e. remove that trailing comma from the name!

Windows, ist umlimited wisdom, by default hides known extensions so you would see .mscz, but not .mscz.
And aldo be default, when renaming a file in Windows via right-click on it in Explorer -> Rename, it doesn't change the Extension, just the basename.

In reply to by R.F.

Yes, please read my previous comment again. What I said is there is no difference in the format itself - the content of the files is *identical*. The only difference is the name. And as I explained previously, MuseScore will not open a file if it ends in a comma. It will be perfectly happy to open the file if you remove the comma. You say you tried to rename the file, but if the comma is still there, then you obviously did not succeed. Perhaps you know someone who is more comfortable with Windows who could help you rename the file?

And yes, we all have these files. These are normal backup files created each time MuseScore opens a file - it creates a copy of the file and add the period at the beginning and comma at the end.

There should be no files in your documents folder that begin with period and do not end with comma. MuseScore does not create files named that way. If you have files named that way, you must have renamed them yourself. Or, you are still using that Windows option we have been telling you that you need to turn off - that everyone who owns a computer should turn off the moment they first set it up, in order to avoid exactly the same sort of confusion you may be having here.

As I suggested previously, feel free to post a screenshot of your Explorer window so we can see *exactly* what you are talking about. But the point is. if you indeed have found the correct backup file, you will be restored back to where you were the last time you opened the file. meaning some of those 80 hours of work may not be lost. Or, if you go to the "Documents and Settings" location we have been telling you to go to, you might find a version of the file saved within two minutes of when you accidentally saved over the original version.

But I really would suggest finding someone a little more familiar with Windows to help, just to make sure you don't do something wrong and destroy your chances of recovering these files.

In reply to by Marc Sabatella

Thanks to all who responded.
I am calling it quits. I`ll leave with what I have and work through the mess.
I am tired of the attitude.... of some.
I went through Documents/settings/local/etc. to the hidden files. My file was not there.
Some of your bold statements, ` might find` did not reassure. It`s either Yes there are backups or No there are not. Might, probably, maybe,could are not backups. I have been working on my files for months. If there are backups, as all are saying, I should have had dozens in the hidden file. The were two with the attributes suggested. The other 10 I could open without doing anything but double click. Are those backups? Not from what I was being told.
If I finish my movement without another disaster, I may try to post my 3 pages, front and back, of errors, problems, why that, what for and plain musical mistakes. Right now, I do not care.

Thanks again for all the considered thoughts, they were gratefully accepted!
And now, GOODBYE!

In reply to by R.F.

You'd have backups, those ".<filename>.mscz," files, almost always, but there are two exceptions: 1st: you saved the file only once (unlikely in this case, as you worked on it for months), 2nd: you deliberatly deleted it (like I do, also unlikely, you'd know about this).
They are not 'hidden'in Windows, but on Mac and Linux (and will be hidden on Windows in the next Version too). But they won't open on a double-click, you'd need to rename them in a way that removes the trailing comma.
To see yourself: Open the folder where you save your score in Explorer, double-click one of the scores, that opens that score in MuseScore. Now make some change to the score in MuseScore and safe the file (no matter wther you Close MuseScore or not). Now look again in Explorer and you'd see the backup file.

Whether you have these 'hidden' temp copies in "C:\Documents and Settings\<yourname>\Application Date\MuseE\MuseScore" or not depends on your MuseScore Settings, but unless you switched it off in preferences, you'd have them. They'd open on a double-click.

In reply to by R.F.

I'm sorry you are finding this so frutrating. We are just trying to help. I am not sure what "attitude" you are referring to to, but we do need information from you in order to help - specific answers to specifics questions we are asking - in order to help better.

Regarding backups - as JoJo says above, they are indeed always created, no maybe about it. Whether or not they are still there when you go to look at them or contain what you expect them to contain depends on what *you* do. That is why we keep trying to explain how these work. The backups in the same folder are created by MuseScore each time you open a file. It creates one backup with a period in front and comma at the end that is an exact copy of the file the way it was when you opened it. If something goes wrong while editing the scorwe, then this backup *will* exist and it *will* contain an exact copy of the file as it looked when you last opened it. The problem is, when you then open the main file again, MuseScore overwrites your backup with a copy of the file as it exists at that moment. So in your case, when you accidentally overwrote your full score with the part, the backup would have been intact. But the moment you actually opened that score, the backup was overwritten to be a copy of the score *as it existed at that moment* - which is to say, it took is just a copy of the part.

This is why I kept suggesting you look instead at the auto save files in Documents and Settings. These are also created automatically, without fail, every two minutes - no "might" about it. But it doesn't keep an infinite number of these around. They are normally cleaned up on a normal exit from MuseScore. But if MuseScore ever crashed while working, then the most recent auto save would still be there waiting for you - nothing ever cleans those up unless you do it yourself manually. *If* MuseScore crashed at a time when your score was still good, then one of those files *does* contain a copy of that score - again, no "might" about it. The only reason one of those files would not be a copy of your score is if MuseScore never crashed while working on it and at a time when the contents were the way you want them. But there is no way we can know this, so that is why we have to say to say it "might" be there. it *will* be there *if the conditions are met*, but we don't know if those conditions were met.

As for your list of questions about how MuseScore works, yes, feel free to post any time, but you should do do so in separate threads - one per question. You might also want to search the forum first to see if any have already been answered, or in the case of bugs or feature requests, if they have already been addressed for 2.0.

In reply to by Marc Sabatella

Marc. After my last post I was not planning to post, again. Since you responded with specific directions, as I asked, here goes. When I started rebuilding my main file, I started checking in Documents/settings/etc/musescore for the `backups`. I work in two files. 1, my main file of the score that I am rebuilding, 1c, my smaller working file. On day one I started checking after I would save. There was no copy of my 1 file. There was a 1c file in Documents/settings/etc. Day two, there was file 1 and also file 1c both to be found in Documents/settings etc. Not after each save, but several times they were both there. Day 3, 1c was there but no time was my large 1 file ever in Documents/settings/etc. And at this point, I was checking sfter each save. No 1 file any time!! In the days since, I have not looked as often, but there have not been any occurences of my 1 file when I looked. I have since stopped looking. I took the advive to make my own backup copy. In all the times I have been looking in the Documents/settings/etc location, since you all pointed me there, I have only found two files there that follow the format you tell me the backups are saved. When I first looked two+ weeks ago, there were 20 or so files there. Two of those were in the backup format (following , ) the rest I could simply double click and open. One of those was from 3 weeks before my problem, the other from Feb. The rest were from various time over the last 5 months. Since I have been rebuilding my file not once, NOT ONCE (yes, an internet shout.... can you hear me now) were either of the files 1 or 1c showing up in the Documents/settings/etc location were in a format I could not open other than double click. So Yes, I still doubt that how you all say this program works, is how the program DOES work... at least WinXP ver 1.3.
Thanks again for the information!

In reply to by R.F.

Again, as I explained previously, the files in the Document and Settings location (we'll call this your Application Data folder) are not "backups", and they are not created when you save. They are "auto-save" files, created for every score you currently have open that has unsaved unchanges, every two minutes (or whatever interval you specify in Edit / Preferences). These are normally cleaned up when you close the score (including on program exit), but they will be left behind if MuseScore crashes.

So after a crash, there will be a file your Application Data folder containing the state of your score as of sometime within the last two minutes before the crash. Again, these are the "auto-save" files. Colloquially, you might think of them as backups, but since that term is used to mean something else - the .mscz, file created in the same folder as your score upon open - it is best not to confusion the two.

The auto-save file will not have a name that resembles your actual score, so no surprise if you don't recognize it when it is present. The name on Windows will be something like "scje7744.mscz". The only way to know which of these files represents your score would be to actually open it in MuseScore (by double clicking, for example). But you should be able to tell from the time stamps on the file which are the recent ones - there are likely a bunch of others there left over from previous crashes.

Everything you wrote above is consistent with what I have said. If you are having trouble seeing this, or believe you are seeing something different, please list the *exact* steps to reproduce the bhavior your are seeing. And by "exact", I mean, like:

1) open musescore
2) open score (and attach the score you are having trouble with)
3) open a Windows Explorer window
4) navigate to the Application Data folder (be sure it's the correct folder - if you don't see a file called "session", it probably isn't)
5) sort folder by time modified so that any newly added scores will appear at the top of the list
6) make a change to your score but don't save it (so oyur score now has unsaved changes)
7) wait two minutes
8) refresh Application Data window

At this point, you should see the new auto-save file appear at the top of your list. Again, it will have a name like "scje7744.mscz". Double click it and it will open in MuseScore and you will see it is an exact copy of the score, including whatever change you made at step 6.

Again, all bets are off if you don't have display of hidden files enabled or if you are using the Windows option to hide file extensions. Any time you plan to muck around with internals on Windows, you absolutely need to have these settings made correctly. That's njot some obscure quirk of MuseScore; it's basic Windows setup. The default settings only work when, well, everything works., If anything ever goes wrong with any program, you will absolutely want these two settings made before you start poking around, or all you will do is confuse yourself and/or make things worse.

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