playback of two voices on one stave

• Apr 21, 2019 - 05:21

machine only plays back notes the first time that they appear in a bar, so if melody in first voice goes down to chord notes in the second voice it does not play melody back.


Comments

Please post the score so we can hear for ourselves what you hear. Also mention the specific measures where the issue occurs, what version of MuseScore...

In reply to by Shoichi

yes, I tried version 3, once I got all the bits togther it installed easily, then when I next logged in it was gone, so I used mint package manager and got version 2.0 or 2.1 I am in tails at the momment and musescore is on hd....

In reply to by mdr

That scopre is from MuserScore 2.1 (and on Linux), upgrade to alt least 2.3.2 (and consider installing 3.0.5 in parallel). You may need to resport to AppImages if these lates versions are not otherwise available for your distribution.

And yes, issues like that have been fixed in later 2.x and 3.x versions, that score plays fine in 2.3.2 and 3.0.5
I guess here you've stumbled accross #12971: Same note in different voices and lengths plays only the length of the shortest note, fixed in MuseScore 2.2

In reply to by Jojo-Schmitz

I took the sample, I opened with MuseScore 3.0.5, I edit the content (to split the voices into 2 staves). I change the voice 2 into 1, so... Now there is just one voice playing.

BUT... In all the cases, before and after the changes I made, I've always get the same: the second "melodic" note (G3) doesn't sound!!!

The only way I can get sound from that note is... To eliminate the chord itself, leaving only the melody!!!

Is it a bug? ???

Attachment Size
sample.mscz 5.52 KB

In reply to by mdr

It would probably take less than 10 seconds to fix the fingerings. Use ctrl+a then ctrl+r to reset the positions of everything. There has been a lot of work on fingerings to make most of your fingering adjustments you did in version 2 unneeded.

In reply to by Marc Sabatella

fingering takes a very long time, and is not helped by having to do everthing twice once in the score and once in parts. When I tried version 3 all the fingering had moved above the stave making the score unusable, luckily I had a backup. Things to do to speed up would include making the arrow keys work quicker, at the moment it is guess how many times to press and then wait a few minutes while it does it, then guess again...

In reply to by mdr

Did you try the reset like we suggested? The reasons things moved is that the defaults are now so much better, most of your your manual adjustments are no longer needed and indeed counterproductive. So again, if you do find problems after the reset, please attach your score so we can investigate.

Not sure what you mean about arrow keys, they shod respond as fast as any others. Again, if you attach your score we can understand and assist better.

In reply to by Marc Sabatella

the first 4 bars of my op11n2. The first file is what it looks like in musescore2, the second what it looks like in musescore3. I tried moving things around in musescore 3 and they just jumped around the place. I don't know if all that fingering above the stave is meant to be "better", not for me, and I suspect that anyone I asked to play it would say the same.

Attachment Size
fourbars.mscz 8.74 KB
fourbarsreset.mscz 8.83 KB

In reply to by mdr

Assuming this is for piano - you entered these as piano fingerings - then stacking the fingers above the staff is absolutely the correct thing, it's exactly what virtually all published music does. it was a major problem that MsueScore 2 couldn't do that, and this is indeed one of the big improvements in MuseScore 3.

However, the fact that you used "0" suggests to me that maybe this isn't for piano, in which case you probably shouldn't have used piano fingerings. If it's for guitar, you should have used the guitar fingering. Not too late,, though - just right-click one, Select / All Similar Elements, then go to the Inspector and change the text style to LH Guitar Fingering. Now it will set very nicely within the staff. And unlike MuseScore 2, room will be created for the fingerings so they don't collide with the barline, which was a big problem in your original version.

In reply to by Marc Sabatella

fingering is for guitar, I didn't know that there was a difference. All the guitar music I can think of it is in stave rather than above, it takes ages checking as few as possible overlaps of fingering with notes and other directions. And it all has to be done twice once in score and once in parts.

as for piano, the old english style is 01234 in my mothers piano music which has now nearly gone, everything is now continental style 12345

In reply to by mdr

Right, so as I said, if you spend the 10 seconds it takes to change your piano fingerings in your old scores into guitar fingerings as I dewcribed, everything is pretty much perfect right out of the box. And in the future, just enter the guitar fingerings to begin with and it will be practically perfect right way. You will hardly have to adjust anything, not in the score or in the part - because the default positioning is so much better in MuseScore 3 than 2.

Also one of the great things about fingering in MuseScore 3 is you quick you can enter them - while editing one fingering, press space and you can move directly to the next note to type another. In other words, enter one fingering normally, double-click it to edit, then hit Space. Now you can just type a number, hit Space, type a number, hit space, type a number, hit Space, etc - just like entering lyrics.

All in all, you will find that contrary to your initial impression that was formed by having used the incorrect fingering type, fingering is actually hugely improved. Between the improved default layout that requires little or no manual adjustment, and the ability to enter them so much more quickly, you will spend far less time on them in MuseScore 3 than 2. You will just have to spend those extra 10 seconds correcting your the text style for your older scores if you want to take advantage of this. Of course, you can also choose to leave those scores in MuseScore 2 and just use MuseScore 3 for new ones.

In reply to by mdr

Not sure what you are asking exactly, but the piano & guitar fingers are both on the Fingerings palette. You'll see two sets of numbers, and if you hover over them, you'll see the second set says "LH Guitar Fingering". As for changing the type after already entering them, this is the "Style" control in the Inspector.

In reply to by mike320

I suspect the reason for this is that really, the piano fingering algorithm applies to most other instruments, guitar is more the odd man odd. But it's always bugged me too, might make sense to change the tooltips anyhow, and then live with the very occasional complaint from people wondering how to do fingering for organ or violin or whatever.

In reply to by Marc Sabatella

OP=old age pensioner?

I attach the musescore3 version, I am performing in six weeks, not from memory so I have to work out how to fit paper score on music stands.....

You were right it took just over ten minutes to find most things in inspector and so on.
To go down some current problems:
1)still have to do score and part seperately,
2)will not select RH so RH and LH fingerings on top of one another,
3)puts rests for the second part on notes for the first,
4)bar 1 will not let me put "non-arp" and "sostenuto" where I want them,
5)bar 17 third beat would prefer "1" a bit lower, as it is it just looks like a vertical bar in the music,
6)bar 19 "4" obscured by flat,
7)bar 22 bottom of "2" hidden, it looks like a backward c
8) bar 33 "tirando" needs moving,
9)bar 49 last beat violin fingering hidden,
10)bar 49 last quaver second part gitar rest covers note,
11)bar 71 bar takes up whole line,
12)bar 89 RH&LH fingerings on top of one another,
13)bar 141 violin part notes and rests overlap,
14)bar 249 "iu, mu" are RH fingerings short for i up m up, I use "u" or "up" to mean up physically although it is down in pitch, some do differently, another way of doing this is putting arrows in the quaver, I hope to scan soon, using lines and arrows from the menu leads to a lot of ink and a mess,
15)bar 283 violin part up bow should follow down bow not both togther, it means in the trill first down bow and continue up bow,

that's enough for now...

Attachment Size
Opus_Eleven_Number_Two_Muse3.mscz 163.54 KB

In reply to by mdr

I am not quite sure what you're asking regarding this score - you want help making the adjustments you mention? Or these are observations where there is room for improvement in the autoplace defaults? I would agree with the latter assessment in many of these cases, but would still notice, in every single one of them, the defaults are a ton better than they were in 2.3.2. So if you've already done the manual adjustments in 2.3.2 and you're happy with them, I say, just keeping using 2.3.2 for that particular score, and use MuseScore 3 to for the enormous benefits it provides for new scores.

Looking at the points individually:

1) Yes, true, in general, adjustments made in the score won't be the same as the parts because layout is different. Some day it would be good to have an explicit command to force particular adjustments to sync, though.

2) I don't understand. You are having trouble selecting RH fingerings? If you originally entered them correctly as RH fingerings, then you should leave those alone, and only change over the ones you entered as piano fingering (Select / More / Same subtype). If you entered them all as piano, you will indeed have to manually find the RH ones and change them to the correct type (RH Guitar Fingering).

3) Yes, neither version autoplaces rests to avoid notes in other voices, it's an improvement we do hope to make some day.

4) You haven't said where you want them. If you want them on the other side of the staff, press "X". If you want them to overlap something else, disable autoplace for those two elements using the Inspector.

5) The default position is aligned with the notehead, but if you prefer it a little higher or lower for whatever reason, you are free to adjust it manually just as in MuseScore 3. I suppose we could consider adding a check to make sure we don't place to close to a staff line, feel free to submit a Suggestion to the issue tracker for that.

6) Indeed, a limitation in the fingering placement algorithm (both 2.3.2 and 3.0) is that goes a chord at a time. Feel free to sumbit a Suggestion to the issue tracker for enhancement.

7) see 5)

8) see 4)

9) Not sure what you mean, it looks like you added "Symbols" to your score rather than use fingerings? These do by default place directly on top of the element you are attaching them to, as often this is the whole reaosn for adding them. Same as 2.3.2. If you prefer them elsewhere, you can move them. But probably better to just use fingerings if that's what these are.

10) see 3)

11) Well, those are pretty full bars, if you want to squeeze them onto a single line, you'll need to reduce stretch or staff size, just as you would in similar situations in any version.

12) That's because are both entered as LH fingerings. Change the txt style to RH for the actual RH fingerings, as per 2)

13) see 3)

14) Not sure what you are asking or suggesting here, but if you want those to act like RH fingerings, best to enter them as such.

15) Also not sure what you mean here. If you place both bowing on the same note, MuseScore won't know what you meant, so if you want one to be to the right of the other, just move it.

In reply to by Marc Sabatella

thanks for taking time to go through all of those. I think that I will follow your advice and stick with version 2 for what I have already done as all the makings have been put where I want them. What is the long term stabilty of musescore? If in 20 years time some one actually wants to publish my work then will everything have depreciated to the extent of being unrecoverable? I still have only converted about 1/4 of my sibelius files to musescore, my experience there was that it was best to start again from the beginning rather than conversion using music html.

Somethings about muse3, I'll try disabling autoplacement, I still have the problem of RH and LH on tp of each other. What would be usefull would be to lower all of the default LH by one perhaps two notches, then all the horizontal part of numbers would not be hidden by the stave.

I have uploaded somewhere else on this site I have uploaded Rasueados p74-75 tennant, I have had some experience trying to notate them, the thing not to do is lines and arrows everywhere.

In reply to by mdr

Being open source, MuseScore will exist as long as there are programmers willing to maintain it. Whereas Sibelius will exist only as long as Avid is continue to be willing to pay people to develop it.

Disabling autoplace should* only* be done where necessary - where you need to create a collision, or to override the default stacking order (eg, you want fingering above tempo for some reason). Otherwise it is counterproductive, it loses all the benefits of improved defaults and less manual adjustments that make MuseScore 3 so much more efficient and the results so much better.

Regarding the fingering, as I said before, the reaosn your RH fingering is on top of your LH is that you entered them both using the same style. Don't do that. The palette has both RH and LH fingerings, you should enter them using the correct style and then they know exactly how to position themselves - LH fingerings beside the note, RH above/below. If this score was imported from MuseScore 2 and you had entered them incorrectly there, you'll have to correct them. But if you entered them correct in MsueScore 2, maybe you accidentally reset them after importing. I had suggested doing Select / All Similar Elements to change all your fingerings, but if you really only wanted to change the piano fingerings, then you can use Select / More / Same substyle. Too late for this version, but maybe you can go back to the original. Or just correct them manually.

If you prefer all your LH fingerings offset by 0.2sp, that's simple. Just move one of them, then click the "S" (set as style) button in the Inspector. Everything else using that same text style will be updated.

In reply to by Marc Sabatella

I am very much a linux user, microsoft uck, sibelius does not run on linux - at least last time I looked, I told them what I thought of that..... everytime sibelius turned up on face booK I would say something like it does not run on linux. No idea what it takes to be a music programmer, I would prefer to write music than to program, is there a programmers guide? The reason I ask is in case something goes wrong with the internet... Think that I will leave my scores as they are for a few months and then come back to them.

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