Symbols disappearing from text when leaving edit mode

• Sep 26, 2014 - 13:55

Hi folks

I'm quite new to Musescore, having been a Sibelius user for a long time. Would like to put a D/F# chord into a lead sheet I'm creating, but every time I input the # symbol and then move on from the chord or exit edit mode, it disappears. Am entering chords the proper way (cmd+K) - using a Mac running OSX Mavericks.

If anyone has any fixes/workarounds, that would be great!


Just typing "D/F#" should work fine, it does for me, under Windows. Are you by chance trying to enter the #-Symbol from the F2 palette instead? That ain't gonna work.

In reply to by Ben Trigg

Don't use that - use the regular "#" key on your keyboard. This automatically gets turned into a sharp sign when the chord is fully rendered upon leaving edit mdoe for that chord. Ditto with "b" for flat sign. If you try to use the actual symbols, it not only doesn't work right, but it also messes up the ability of MuseScore to recognize the chord and treat it correctly with respect to transposition, MusicXML export, etc.

In reply to by Jojo-Schmitz

Perhaps - we could detect when someone incorrectly uses one of those symbols, and convert it to "#" or "b" for them automatically. Perhaps better would be be to simply disallow entering those characters in the first place - that way people wpuld be forced to realize they are doing it incorrectly.

In reply to by Jojo-Schmitz

Not so sure that applies here though. If people are erroneously going through all those extra steps every time they want a flat or sharp sign, shouldn't we take steps to educate them to make their life easier in the future? Otherwise they continue working much harder than necessary, thus diminishing their experience and making them incorrectly think of MuseScore as hard to use in this respect.

In reply to by Jojo-Schmitz

I don't understand. You think it is easier to press F2, find the flat icon, double click it, and close the F2 palette, than it is to simply press "b"? How it doing the user a favor to let him continue doing things the hard way?

I do have another idea though - pressing F2 while in chord symbol mode could open a special version of the symbols palette that contained only the symbols used in chord symbol entry - flat, sharp, diminished, half-diminished, triangle - each clearly labeled with its keyboard shortcut. In fact, the palette would not even have to *work* - it could be purely information.

In reply to by Jojo-Schmitz

It's not Mac keybaords in general that lack "#" keys, but I think the version for some specific countries might not. Still, they have well-known combinations to produce it. They didn't work at one point in MuseScore; this may have been a Qt issue fixed by now. Anyone know?

Anyhow, as it turns out, I had already implemented code to do translation from sharp sign to "#" and from flat sign to "b" for chord symbols imported from 1.3; it just wasn't being used for newly entered chords. It's a simple change to make it so, so if someone files an issue, I'll go ahead and make this work.

But I still don't like the idea of encouraging users to think MuseScore requires them to constantly open and close palettes and double click icons just to enter chord symbols. Which is why I'm kind of liking the idea of a special informational F2 palette to inform them of how easy it actually is.

In reply to by Marc Sabatella

Encourage !=Allow :-)
Telling users that the easiest way is to just use plain b and # and automagically turning it into flat and sharp for them is good enough, forcing them to make this the only way without a compelling technical reason is wrong IMHO.
Think about note entry via mouse, it is clearly stated to not be the most efficient way of doing it, but it is allowed (and without this I'd be screwed, not being on a first name base with them :-)

Compare 'using # for sharp is wrong' vs. 'MuseScore does not support this' vs. 'This is possible but it would be easier to just use a plain #...'

In reply to by Ben Trigg

I discovered this thread. I tried this D / F # (the sharp entered from the keyboard).

I am surprised by this: when I leave the text editing mode, the F # suddenly descends from a stair step. And returns at its initial place when I want edit again, and so on. Is this a bug?

(I am under Windows7)



Attachment Size
D.jpg 6.32 KB
D2.jpg 5.5 KB

In reply to by cadiz1

No, it is the default rendering behavior to place the bass note slightly below the rest of the chord. While you are editing the chord symbol is just plain text, so all one font, all "normal" characters, etc. But when you leave edit mode, the chord is then processed and "rendered" into something more pleasing visually - the "b" and "#" changed to flat and sharp, "0" changed to the half-diminished sign, the bass note written slightly below the rest of the chord, etc. In the "Jazz" style there are many more such that happen in rendering - superscripting of alterations, change of size for various different elements, etc.

There are a million different ways people like to write chord symbols, and in 2.0 Beta we support as many as we can as far as input goes, but there are really only two main styles we support regarding how they render - Standard and Jazz (Style / General / Chord Symbols). We do support custom chord description files that allow you to control these sort of details, but currently, there is no other direct way to control formatting.

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