Playback short notes and rhythm chords for bass clef without using staccato
Hi all,
I would like to write my bass and rhythm chords as normal crotchets, but have them play back as short staccato, especially when the tempo slows down. This is to simulate tidy left hand accordion technique.
The problem is that Musescore uses the full note length for this reed instrument for bass clef, whereas a plucked string instrument does this "staccato" rhythm naturally.
Putting staccato markings over quaver notes gets close to real life, but the notation looks weird, and the playback articulation changes when tempo changes.
Is there a setting in Musescore that will allow a defined playback length regardless of notation? eg some thing like in the element inspector to specify milliseconds?
A friend of mine showed me how to do this after exporting to a midi editor, but it is very fiddly.
Please see attached example.
Who ever solves this problem gets one of my famous German beer drinking pieces : ) lol
Thank you
Paul
| Attachment | Size |
|---|---|
| Bass and Rhythm note length.mscz | 6.45 KB |
Comments
You can add a second Instrument and make it invisible. But I don't think it's orthodox: What you see is not what you hear...
In reply to You can add a second… by Shoichi
Thank you for the suggestion, and good idea.
But alas it will still stretch the chords when the tempo decreases, and adds a fair bit of work for big scores.
If there was only a "play only for X milliseconds" adjustment for each note that can be copied over multiple rhythm bars it would be terrific. Then when there is a tempo change, the rest of the time is taken up by more silence to keep good technique on the chords.
In reply to Thank you for the suggestion… by Paul6
A right click on the measure to access the 'Piano Roll Editor'?
See: https://musescore.org/en/node/74651
But I fear that any method is rather laborious.
In reply to A right click on the measure… by Shoichi
Getting closer : )
I used "Piano Roll Editor " to change the length from 1000 to 150 eg "Len:150"
I can now keep the crotchets in the score, and it will play back quaver staccato - like a real accordion musician would for their left hand.
Also the edited bars can be copied and the Piano Roll Editing is copied as well, so it is not too laborious
But, the playback length is still affected by tempo change, when I really need a constant play duration
What would be fantastic is a simple note duration option in the "Inspector Element" in milliseconds so I don't have to go into Piano roll. There is something there already for Velocity type.
Should I put this in as a request, or is there something I am missing?
Thank you
In reply to Getting closer : )… by Paul6
Please wait patiently for a better response ;-)
I think this might have something to do with it, but not sure.
https://musescore.org/en/node/10410
I was looking through the forum and found something on pizzicato for strings, which seems to work no matter what tempo, slow or fast.
https://musescore.org/en/node/273599
This is very similar to what bass clef left hand Accordion needs, just maybe a just little less short, more like staccato.
Is it possible to use this for bass clef accordion?
Generally speaking, all good accordion players play short rhythm chords. see https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rAnDHVCc4Ts Go to 1:30 min ( in this example she plays chords very short, even though they may be written as crotchets )
Anybody have some more ideas?
In reply to I was looking through the… by Paul6
It works for strings because the General MIDI standard defines pizzicato as a sound for all synths / soundfonts to include, and that allows us to rely on it being presen. It doesn't do the same for the short accordion notes, however. If you can find a non-General-MIDI soundfont that includes the sound, though, you would be avble to use it in more or less the same way with some setup (eg, adding your accordion as a violin then changing the sound, so MuseScore will know there are multiple sounds available).
In reply to It works for strings because… by Marc Sabatella
Hi Marc,
Yes I was thinking exactly the same thing. Started with violin, changed to accordion in the mixer, but then came unstuck when I realized there was no pizzicato sound font for accordion. What a shame, as it is such a critical requirement for this instrument to sound good in Musescore.
In reply to Hi Marc,… by Paul6
If it's critical, then some other accordion player has presumably felt the same and created a soundfont containing the sound. You just need to find it :-)
In reply to If it's critical, then some… by Marc Sabatella
I thought so too, so I purchased the two top specialized accordion sound fonts to see if this is the case.
http://virtual-acoustic.com/index.php/en/kontakt-sample-packs/guerrini-…
http://store.precisionsound.net/shop/weltmeister-accordion/
None have specifically sampled staccato bass/chords. I can only assume that their customers use the other software "Kontakt" suggested on their websites.
Can I put in a request for a feature to fix this for Musescore ?
In reply to I thought so too, so I… by Paul6
I came across this, but don't quite understand the solution, or if it can be used?
"Staccato note duration on flute too long"
https://musescore.org/en/node/25259
In reply to I came across this, but don… by Paul6
It brings me back to having an option in "Inspector Element", that allows for a custom note length duration in milliseconds ( not ticks for midi). This would allow for customizing the correct staccato feeling for each instrument type, eg Flute is different from Piano, which is different from Clarinet. I suspect staccato for a flautist is very particular sound which is obvious to their ears, and maybe not to others.
In reply to It brings me back to having… by Paul6
Also:
I made a pizzicato soundfont. (Same accordion sound in MS-General soundfont)
Length is not affected by speed/tempo changes or note durations.
See attachment.
Notice: Effects can cause the actual note length to sound more like it. (Synthesizer -> Master effects -> Zita1)
PS: If you can add (attach) a sample score here, I can check how it is heard.
In reply to I came across this, but don… by Paul6
>"Staccato note duration on flute too long"
It's a very old subject and it doesn't apply right now.
>""Inspector Element", that allows for a custom note length duration in milliseconds ( not ticks for midi)
In my opinion, also midi-tick is acceptable. (Instead of the thousandths percentage value)
As long as the sample's release time is long enough for the pizzicato, it's enough to enter a value close to the smallest tick in it. (for triggering). This is enough to simulate: a pizzicato sampling. Guitar strum, special arpeggio styles, muted guitar sound, and so on.
In reply to It's a very old subject and… by Ziya Mete Demircan
Hi Ziya,
Thanks for your effort, but I have a very specific sound font that I need to use. ( the one inMusescore is ok, but not fantastic ) I suspect it would take a very long time to create all the short notes in a new SF2 sound font as each and every note in my professional font was sampled, not just one octave. I also have several other accordion left hand sounds, and just can't spend the time pulling apart proprietary sound fonts for every reed combo. ( I don't know how, and I dont think that is allowed under their rules as it is not my property)
But, I think I have a good solution, which is independant of instrument.
I have created a Bass/Rhythm template, with all the regular chords which are used in standard bass accordion ( Otherwise known as Stradella M,m 7 and d chords ). I then went in to Piano Roll and changed the bass notes to 300, and the chords to 175, to give a nice short attack. When I copy from my chord chart template, it also copies over the Piano Roll duration length, and saves a lot of time.
There is just one problem, I still have to change many notes to short duration, and need to be able to bulk update all the durations on the piano roll. I have opened another thread on this to see if I can get some help on this issue.
https://musescore.org/en/node/273891