Bass Guitar (4-string) TAB Clef is same size as 6-string TAB clef

• Sep 16, 2016 - 19:19

MuseScore 2.0 and 3.0, Windows any version.

I believe this to be incorrect. See the attached .png file as a classic bass guitar tabs example.

See the attached MuseScore 2.0 file for an example of how MuseScore looks with a 4-string tab clef vs. a 6-string tab clef. I don't think the clef should exceed the top/bottom staff line boundaries.

If there is agreement on this, I will file an issue in the Issue Tracker.

Attachment Size
Bass_Tab_Clef.mscz 8.61 KB
Frère Jacques.png 41.03 KB

Comments

• Sep 16, 2016 - 20:00

?? Of course a 6-string tab staff is bigger than a 4 - not sure why you would expect otherwise? Your PNG doesn't show a 6-string tab staff at all - it shows a 5 line standard staff. Not the same thing at all.

EDIT: never mind, I see you are talking about the *clef*, not the *staff*. I've actually seen it both ways. Rather than try to do some sort of automatic scaling - how would 3 or 5 lines be handled? what if the line spacing is set to something other than 1.5? - maybe we should simply provide an alternate smaller clef?

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• Sep 16, 2016 - 20:30

I share some of your questions. I don't have a strong opinion on how to handle this, as I'm not a hardcore user of tabs. So I'm waiting for any tablature heavyweights to weigh in on the importance of this how this should be handled for all the various numbers of strings that an instrument might have.

I notice that various standard notation clefs exceed the vertical staff line boundaries, the standard treble clef being the most obvious example. I ran into this mostly because I position my measure numbers for parts at the start of each system, right above the staff lines, between the edge of the page and the top of any treble clef. I was doing fine, not overlapping the measure numbers and the top of the clef, but then the bass TABS clef came along and it took up a lot more space. So I looked around to see how it was handled elsewhere. I selected all the clefs and horizontally adjusted them to fix my problem in this one part, but I'm curious to see if there is consensus on how this should be handled.

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• Sep 17, 2016 - 19:54

" maybe we should simply provide an alternate smaller clef?"

Absolutely, this is the best way in my opinion too.

I agree with "sideways": the Standard Tab clef is absolutely not suited for four-line Tabs, used for instruments like bass, ukulele, mandolin and many other traditional plucked instruments (cuatro, timple, cavaquinho... many others!)

Currently, we have two Tab clefs : the Standard TAB clef , and the Serif TAB clef (perhaps more suited to historical tablatures, but it is a matter of debate and the likes of everyone, so, no really matter)

So, I advocate the addition of the 4-string tab clef, currently available in the Symbols.
4 string tabl clef.jpg

The workaround for now is to untick, in Staff Properties, "Show clef", and then, manually add this 4-string tab clef.
This requires some manipulation to reposition correctly. It is doable of course, but I think it would be appropriate, and expected, to have this Tab clef in the palette.

I observe, eg, on musescore.com (search: ukulele tab) : there is about fifteen scores for ukulele. All show the (large) default clef.
The "average" users do not know this workaround. It would be useful to simplify their task by providing a real visibility and accessibility to this clef, and also, and simply to have a clef that is in line with the published scores.

I own several books of ukulele. Overwhelmingly, I see this clef.
Eg:
Track.jpg
Same if you go on publishers sites, eg Mel Bay -> ukulele -> following the overview paragraph: read more -> samples. You will see this 4-string clef.

- To make the point:
Currently, by default, with MuseScore: 6-string instruments, 5-string, or 4-string, we get:

The first result is not satisfactory (especially for 4-line tabs, here ukulele)
MuseScore.jpg
The second - Serif Tab clef - is better (with the reservations expressed above for style), but still not satisfactory.
Serif.jpg
With the addition of the 4-string Tab clef, we could get this:
Voeu MuseScore2.jpg
or this (my favorite maybe!)
Voeu MuseScore.jpg
For some other softwares, by default, I receive this.
Sibelius 7.5 ( updated in following versions?), not better.
Sibelius.jpg

Finale 2012, and Guitar Pro 2015, better.
Finale.jpg
GP.jpg

I'll file a feature request soon.

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• Sep 17, 2016 - 22:52

Adding an existing glyph to the palette should be easy, right? If someone can give me some context or ideally guidance as to how to add stuff to the palette, I'll file the PR and make the change. I can't imagine anyone objecting to adding an existing glyph to the palette, especially when there is demand for it.
I won't object if someone with experience does it instead of me, I'm simply offering. It doesn't sound like a difficult change to make. This is looking far more straightforward than I originally imagined, which is good.

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• Sep 18, 2016 - 01:47

clef.h
- add a 3rd tab clef to the clefType enum

clef.cpp
- add a line to the ClefInfo table, most of the info can be direct-copied from one of the other TAB clef entries. Accidentals are the same, which is the diciest part.
- Clef::layout() - add a case to the switch() in which the y-offset for this new clef is set. I assume the y-offset is based on the width of the glyph. I can compare this smaller tab clef to the others to determine a value.

That sounds like the easy part to me. The palette I'm not so sure about, though it's probably a snap. Also the linkage between 4-lines and this clef that happens automatically when you select the staff type, where does that happen? Is it in the xml instrument definitions? What about when I change the staff type in the staff properties dialog or the edit instrument dialog? That will need handling too, ideally. Though I suppose just making the clef available would be a good start.

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• Sep 18, 2016 - 02:24

The setting of the SymId also slipped my initial examination. I see SymId::sixStringTabClef and how it is declared, but I don't see how it is connected to a character in a font. And sixStringTabClef is part of "oldNames" in sym.cpp, which makes me wonder if it's current.

I'm looking at the MuseScore font right now and I only see a serif small Tab clef, not a sans-serif version. The big sans serif clef is char code: E06D. The serif clefs are (big, small): E1A2, E1A3.

Are those the available glyphs? Is there no small sans-serif Tab clef? It would be easy enough to create one in font forge.

It looks like the glyphnames.json and/or metadata.json files in the MuseScore/fonts/mscore folder need to change too. The sans serif clef is "defined" in glyphnames.json. The serif font is in metadata.json. I don't know why they are not in the same file, and I've never worked with JSON. Adding an entry seems easy enough, but I'd like to make sure I'm adding the right entry.

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• Feb 8, 2019 - 23:25

I am bringing this issue back from the ashes. The current fallback mechanism uses Bravura, and the Bravura 4 string TAB clef looks too skinny next to the mscore 6 string clef, IMHO.
I have added my own 4 string TAB clef to the mscore.ttf font, which is based on Emmentaler:
tab_clefs.png

It will work for 5 string bass too, as it's a bit tight for the 4 string staff. This is 70% scale. It's simply a scaling of the 6 string clef's glyph, so doing it again to a different scale is easy. Officially, SMuFL has two TAB clef glyphs, for 6 and 4 strings. I think this is the right size because
a) any smaller is too small, and
b) it will work well for 5 string staves

The issue referenced in the previous comment is closed. I would like to create a PR for this font change. Is that possible? I assume you'd want the .sfd and .ttf files both updated.

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