How to change pizz to arco

• Nov 12, 2016 - 00:41

So my friend gave a a file but i want to change a violin part pizz to arco how do i do that?


Comments

You can change the playback of violin pizzicato to arco by adding a stave text (default shortcut Ctrl+T after selecting a note of the stave). You can add anything in that textbox, but make sure it has data. Right click the text and select the option 'Stave text properties'. Under the 'Change Channel' tab, choose any of the voices that are to be changed. Click on the pull-down menu next to the boxes and select 'normal'.

See: https://musescore.org/en/node/50196

In reply to by John Morton

5 years later this may not be relevant at all.

Just apply the arco or pizz texts from the palette to a violin staff and it will sound acro resp. pizzicato.
If not, change the instrument to violin (even if if is violon already, but stems from an older score)

See also the below link to the handbook

In reply to by John Morton

"Five years later" meaning, you are replying to a five year old thread that was discussing a totally different version of MuseScore.

In current versions, as per the Handbook, you don't normally need to know anything about channels, just add the pizz or arco text from the palette and everything works automatically.

In reply to by John Morton

It won't necessarily work if the score itself is also years old, as the channel names have changed. Or if it is not actually a viol (or other string) instrument, but some other one with the playback sound only changed to violin. Either way, the fix would be to right-click the staff, Staff/Part Properties, and Change Instrument, selecting the proper instrument this time.

And as always, if you continue to have problems., attaching your score allows us to assist you much more quickly and accurately.

In reply to by Marc Sabatella

Thank you as always for your time. It's a brand new score produced in the current version of MuseScore using the native string sounds. If I sound impatient it is because you and I had this same conversation several years ago and here I am, again, unable to change from arco to pizz and back. My MuseScore files are taken, as Midi files, into Logic Pro, which is why the problem has just cropped up again, so the problem is solved in Logic. I can't let go of the score, unfortunately. (I can't change the instrument stack order with the up arrow, either, now but that's another thread and I understand why this has changed.) Don't worry about this. It's a detail for me.

In reply to by Jojo-Schmitz

I have solved the problem. When changing back from pizz. to arco, for example, it is necessary to click on the voice to reaffirm the voice selection even if it hasn't changed. The menu was already showing 'voice 1', which is what I needed, so I left it alone. One would expect the menu to be still showing 'pizz.' until the change back to arco is specified, but it doesn't. The bass part in my score is voice 1 all the way through. There is still the mystery of why, when I tried this morning, I couldn't get the first articulation change to work. Then I came back to it, did exactly the same thing, and it worked.

In reply to by bobjp

If you do as you both say it will (usually) work with the first articulation change but when you try to change back, in my case from pizz to arco, it will not work unless you reaffirm the voice selection, which hasn't changed in my score. Also, the menu at the point of the return to arco would be expected to still be showing 'pizz' since it is the current selection. The development team need to read the instructions through the eyes of someone who is new to the subject and ask themselves if clarification is necessary, not argue with me. I've been using notation software since 1995 (Encore, Finale) and bought my first computer in 1988 and yet this simple task took me around two hours.

In reply to by John Morton

sample score and step-by-step procedure please

My sample score is above, procedure:
MuseScore 3.6.2 on Windows 10, using the HQ soundfont
New score, add bass, 3 measures, fill measures with notes, all sound arco.
Apply pizz (from the text palatte) to 1st note in 2nd measure and arco to 1st noted in 3rd measure -> playback switches to pizz and back to arco at the specified notes

In reply to by bobjp

The staff text menu.

The instructions in the manual regarding reverting back to the original articulation, in my case, from 'pizz' back to 'arco', do not make it clear that, despite the fact that I haven't changed voices, and I haven't used a voice change anywhere in the instrument part, anyway, I still have to reaffirm the voice selection. I also find it puzzling that the staff text menu doesn't show 'pizz' when I right-click on the text to change it back to arco, since pizz is still the prevailing articulation at that point. Now, I like to think I am not a fool but it took me a long time to sort this problem out therefore I claim that the wording needs clarification. i.e. 'Click once more on the required voice to select the articulation shown....' or words to that effect. I hope everyone understands, this time because I really am out of here now.

Thanks to everyone.

In reply to by Jojo-Schmitz

Yes, re-wording would have saved me a lot of time but we are only tampering with the symptoms. The program should still show voice 1 (or whatever) selected in blue and, in the case of my score, 'pizz', in the menu when I right-click on the text, at the point I wish to change the articulation back to 'arco', because these were the last selections. That way, anyone will understand. If I click on the first note of the section I wish to change I still hear pizz, until I change it, so the program has a record of the prevailing situation. I also wonder why voice selection should enter into a situation where the particular instrument hasn't used voices, and usually never would, but this might be unfair criticism, perhaps.

In reply to by John Morton

But you aren't changing instruments, only the articulation. That is not done via staff text. Ever. Select the note where you want the pizz to start. Select pizz from the text palette. Later select the note you want to start the arco. Select arco from the text palette.

In reply to by John Morton

Again, you don't normally need to look at the dialog, ever. Like, literally it is not needed at all except in the most unusual of cases. If you have one of those usunual special cases where it is needed, please attach your score so we can understand and assist better.

But again, it's not about "reaffirming" anything. When that dialog is opened, the is no voice selection to affirm or reaffirm or deny or other recognize. It is asking you a simple question; what voice do you want to apply this setting. It has nothing to do with whether or not at some point in the past you happened to have selected some voice or not. It's about what you want to do right now. And again, it's only needed in the very rare special situations where you actually want to do something unusual like have a single text apply differently to different voices. That should virtually never happen with arco or pizz.

In reply to by John Morton

Don't think of it as being about whether you've "changed" voices or whether you have "selected" a voice or whether you are "affirming" or "reaffirming" anything. The staff text properties does one thing here: it allows you to specify which voices the sound change will apply to. If you want it to be voice 1, great, select voice 1. If you want it to be voice 2, great, select voice 2. If you want it to be all voices, great, select all voices.

It would be great indeed if somehow MuseScore could guess your intent, but unfortunately since this dialog is used for multiple different types of text, it's not possible in general to know. No doubt it would be possible to design a dialog that worked different and didn't require this selection, and no doubt it would be possible to improve the documentation. We always welcome specific suggestions on these counts!

Luckily, as mentioned, dealing with this dialog also completely unnecessary in most cases. Unless you are doing something unusual, you never need to open this dialog. Simply add the text from the palette and everything works perfectly right out of the box. I can't remember the last time I ever needed to resort to this dialog.

In reply to by Marc Sabatella

This is a disappointing response. I am a person of, shall we say, 'average' intelligence, with 33 years of experience using computers and programs and I've been using MuseScore for many years. I found the process presently discussed (which I usually effect in Logic) difficult and, in describing my problems, I hoped you might consider changes in the wording or program function that would help others. Clearly, this doesn't worry you.

I am not asking the program to 'guess' anything. When assigning text or changing notated accents (etc.) we just click the note and go from there.

You DON'T just add text and expect the change to work, which is why I started this exchange in the first place. You have to enter the dialog menu and reaffirm Voice 1 (or whatever) or it doesn't work. This is the whole point of my post. 'Finale' works as you suggest (but, with ease of interaction, MuseScore beats Finale with ease).

In reply to by John Morton

You do just add the arco and/or pizz text from the text palette and they do work immediatelly.
If you are manually adding some arbitrary staff texts, you indeed do need to jump though some extra hoops, in this case right-click, staff text properties, select the voices and the channel to use, just like described in the handbook. No rocket science...

In reply to by Jojo-Schmitz

Please no sarcasm, it does you no credit. I'm just as frustrated by all this as everyone else. I just tried yet again and it doesn't work as you describe. I'm not adding arbitrary staff test I'm following the manual exactly. You have to right-click and reaffirm the Voice selection. I can't think of anything to add to all this.

In reply to by John Morton

I think there is no sarcasm involved here. JoJo just wants to help.

After reading through the conversation I think the possible source of the confusion is that there are two ways to do this:
1. Adding a staff text from the Add→Text→Staff Text menu. Then right-click the text and select "Staff Text Properties", and define which voices should use which "sound".
2. Add predefined "pizz" and "arco" staff-texts from the "text" pallet on the left. These predefined text already are set up to change voice 1 to pizz/arco.

My understanding is that you John are using method 1 above, and are annoyed that when you do this for the second time on a staff, to switch back to arco, the predefined selection in the dialog-window does not show the "current" setting on the branch. It always shows a dialog where all channels have "arco" pre-selected. You would want it to say "pizz" in channel 1 if you previously on the staff did that change. It also has no voice selected for any of the channels, which I guess you think is OK. Not all staff texts will want to apply voice sound changes.

And it is not clear that you have tried method 2. If you do apply the predefined "pizz" text from the text-pallet, and then right-click on it and select "Staff Text Properties" you will see that it will assign voice 1 to the "pizz" sound.

In reply to by AndreasKågedal

Referring to 'rocket science' was patronising, not helpful.

I've been using method 1 and I understood how things work but the manual misleads the user because it does not tell you to select the voice again, when changing back from pizz to arco, even though it is displayed in the dialog and has not been changed, anyway. I've just tried this yet again to make triply, quadruply sure. Until I select the voice, the sound doesn't change. Nevertheless, I can now make it work, which is the main thing. I will leave you to decide whether or not to make changes to avoid future exchanges such as the present one.

In reply to by John Morton

It is important that the voice is not selected by default. The reason is that staff text is used for many other things than switching sound. And if a voice was always assigned a sound (even if the same as earlier in the same staff") that means that if you copy or move (cut/past) the text to some other part of the score, also the assignment of sound would be copied. This is to be expected for the "pizz" text, but not for a "2x tacet" text for instance. So it important that no sound change is included in the "2x tacet" text, even if the change is to the same sound as before.

In reply to by AndreasKågedal

I realise all that. I'm suggesting that the sound and voice command in the dialogue box, once ascribed, should remain until altered. As it is, we have to select the voice again, which isn't made clear, and, at the point of the change back to arco, I would expect the box to still be showing pizz because that is the prevailing command and I would expect the voice to still be highlighted in blue.

In reply to by John Morton

There's no still as it is a new and entirely separate text that doesn't know anything about any other previous channel change text.
It is just a mere staff text that doesn't do any change to those channels.

Even if,if won't make sense to restrict it to voice 1. The texts in the palette do switch all 4 voices

In reply to by John Morton

Again, if you're using the dialog at all, you aren't following the Handbook. The procedure in the Handbook is only for unusual special cases other than pizz or arco, which absolutely do not require use of this dialog at all in most cases.

But in the rare cases where it is needed, indeed, the dialog you bring up for an arco text has no recollection of what voice you might have selected at some point in the past when editing some other text. It just wants you to say which voices this particular text should apply to. It shoudln't matter whether you've ever used this dialog before on another text; MuseScore doesn't keep a history of that. And even it did, what would you expect to happen if you edited the texts out of order?

In reply to by Marc Sabatella

If you look at my OP you will see how the procedure confused me and I thought that others might be similarly confused. That is what this discussion is essentially about. I've tried over and over again and the sound does not change unless the dialogue is invoked.

Generally, when you change note attributes, you select the note, not adjacent text, and this command will stay in force until cancelled, which is what I 'expect'.

I don't see any practically useful end product to this discussion, now, but thank you for your time.

In reply to by John Morton

The usefuyl end will come if you do as we have repeatedly asked and actually attach your score and give precise steps to reproduce the problem you are perceiving. As we keep explaining, the text works perfectly out of the box for all new new or relatively-recently-created created. For especially old ones, worst case is you need to do to Staff/Part Properties and do a "Change Instrument" (back to the same instrument) to reset the channels names to be what they should be. You only need to do that once, so it's a way better approach than constantly bringing up that dialog to change each and every text throughout the score.

But again, in the rare cases where the dialog is needed, it works exactly as we have explained, no "reaffirming" of anything needed. The dialog doesn't have memory of past events that applied to other text, it only knows what you tell it to do with this text.

I could certainly see expecting pizz to be a note property rather than a text property, but since a humn musician needs to see the text, it makes more sense to implement it that way. In any cas,e that has nothing to do with voices or affirmations, and certainly the Handbook is completely clear that the dialog applies to texts, not notes. You can't even get there by selecting a note - it only appears when you right-click atext. So it should be obvious it applies to the text. But again, as we've said, if you feel the wording can be improved, feel free to help out in that way.

In reply to by Marc Sabatella

Yes it does, no it doesn't...
yes it does, no it doesn't...
yes it does, no it doesn't...

I was suggesting a change in the way the program works. I understand everything else except that, as I, too, have 'repeatedly said', the method doesn't work as the 'perfectly clear' handbook describes.

Have you considered that Apple's backwards-compatibility problem is rearing its head? I'm running Mojave. System changes on a Mac can affect the way applications run. I can't recall the details of the last instance I encountered but I vaguely recall it was a roughly similar glitch.

I have already explained I can't release the score and if I send a test score the results will be inconclusive.

In reply to by John Morton

I continue to be available to help you, but as mentioned repeatedly,. the first step in that would be for you to actually attach your score and give us precise steps to reproduce the problem. Then we can see if the problem is your score or with the steps you are following and show you how to correct it.

I am not sure why you believe you cannot attach the score, but if you are concerned with violating a contract you signed with someone else, just delete all but the relevant measures.

A change to how the program works is certainly possible. First step there then would be to produce some good diagrams outlining your vision for how you think the process should work.

but again, it 99.99% moot, as 99.99% of the time, the dialog is unnecessary. It doesn't need to handed the plain simple cases, as the plain simple cases don't need the dialog. Only the extremely unusual ones do, so be sure your design handles those cases well.

Nothing about what has discussed here seems at all likely to have

In reply to by Marc Sabatella

You have indeed made yourself available and I'm grateful to you and your patience. When you helped me with another problem recently the source of the problem was found to be in the (correct) use of a 12-note tuplet in a bar a few pages forward, so your suggestion of eliminating bars wouldn't produce a conclusive result.

Changing to Mojave caused me to lose the Garritan instruments in Finale, I do remember that, which is why I suggested Mojave as a way out of the dilemma but I have found that, if I reaffirm the voice selection, I can now make everything work so I'm happy. Despite all indications to the contrary, MuseScore is my program of choice and I use it exclusively.

Thank you again, JM.

In reply to by John Morton

I have made some updates (first time!) to the Staff Text Properties sub-chapter in the handbook. These might not be enough to make John happy, but I hope they make the current behavior of the staff text playback properties slightly more clear.

Please have a look, and make updates/corrections (or revert to the old text if you do not think this is the way to describe this).

I think there are also some opportunities for improvements in the Mid-staff sound change chapter. I'll see if I will have go there too, later.

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