Allow a better support of medieval and renaissance symbols (available in palettes, playable, etc.)

• Sep 21, 2019 - 01:35
Reported version
3.2
Type
Development
Frequency
Few
Severity
S5 - Suggestion
Reproducibility
Always
Status
active
Regression
No
Workaround
No
Project

We need a font that is suitable for transcribing Mediaeval and Renaissance music. If Musescore cannot develop one, they should make it possible to integrate external fonts such as November 2.


Comments

It's not out of the question that we would someday support external fonts, although it's more likely that if a suitable open source font is found that fulfills a need, we would simply include that. November 2, I believe, is commercial, so that seems out of the question for inclusion. Are there particular aspects of this font that you feel are not duplicated in the available open source fonts? If so, that would probably make a good forum discussion.

As Barvura implements the full SMuFL set, it should support every possible notation.
I don't see how November would add any value, except for a different look.

In reply to by Marc Sabatella

Right now, all of the Mediaeval and Renaissance notation symbols available on Musescore (with the exception of mensuration signs) are only manipulable as symbols, and as such cannot be played back or used for note input in any practical way. If you could integrate all those symbols into one font, or add them to an existing font, it would make it possible to create beautiful reproductions of early music.

In reply to by joshuaaroberts

So it sounds you are saying the symbols are there but aren't being used for notes. In which case, all that should be required is a new notehead style like we already have for named noteheads) to use these? Or perhaps alternate hook styles too? As far as I can tell, that would be all that is required to produce something like the example shown.

In reply to by Marc Sabatella

That would be immensely helpful, but it's not only the notes that I'm concerned with. Clefs, accidentals, articulations, and other miscellaneous items would have to be added to make it work. Again, most of these exist as symbols in the Master Palette but are not usable for projects of any scale. They're fine for incipit staves, but anything more gets incredibly tedious.

In reply to by joshuaaroberts

Ok, but again - it sounds like you are saying the font already has the symbs, we just need an option to use them?

As far as I can tell it would be absolutely no different with November 2. Like our fonts, it is SMuFL-compliant and designed for general purpose usage, so in order.to get all those fancy glyphs, we'd need that same option or set of options.

In reply to by Jojo-Schmitz

What my initial post said was: "We need a font that is suitable for transcribing Mediaeval and Renaissance music. If Musescore cannot develop one, they should make it possible to integrate external fonts..." This is all I meant. If Musescore can make it possible to create good early music editions with what they already have, then I don't need external fonts. If they cannot, then it would be great to be able to use a font such as Chigi by Dr. Duffin or something similar.

@joshuaaroberts.
Unfortunately, I fear that this is a wishful thinking. Even I would personally support this improvement, this kind of request comes up against the fact that no developer at the moment has enough taste (and time and desire) for early music - at least that's my thought.

There was one, who had this taste and ability, Maurizio Gavioli (the one who had implemented the Renaissance and Baroque part - a little for the Baroque period) for MuseScore. But this one hasn't been involved for a long time now.
MuseScore continues to make huge progress, and more are to come (I'm thinking in particular of chord symbols playback), and certainly others, but once again, on the early music side, we're at a complete standstill since two years. My feelings.

I'm not so pessismistic :-). Sure, we miss @miwarre (Maurizio), and right now there is no one in a position to take leadership on early music issues. But new people come on board all the time, and I figure it's just a matter of time before one of them is another early music specialist. And realistically, a staff property or style setting to change over all the basic glyphs for alternatives is nowhere near as hard to implement as tablature was. Really what it takes more than anything is insight into what needs changing.

I'm sure to do a really great job of it there is more than just swapping out glyphs, but the point is, much of the infrastructure is there, and there really is no reason it cannot be done.

"But new people come on board all the time, and I figure it's just a matter of time before one of them is another early music specialist."
Hmm, it's like betting on a game of chance! :)

"Really what it takes more than anything is insight into what needs changing"
I guess the main points were made in a previous comment, I quote: "If the symbols can be added to their respective palettes and can function as such (i. e. a Petrucci clef actually changes the pitches on a staff, or a mediaeval neume is playable), then that would be sufficient for most projects."

Title Allowing external music fonts Allow a better support of medieval and renaissance symbols (available in palettes, playable, etc.)
Frequency Few

New title, taking into account the above discussion.
@joshuaaroberts: I'm not sure the title is the best possible. Feel free to improve it if necessary.