Violin notes out of tune, caused by sample "Violin B6(L)" in FluidR3Mono
Having recently created a replica score of Mozart's Eine Kleine Nachtmusik for string quartet, I have noticed that in the violin parts anything between (and including) G#5 (830.6Hz) and C#6 (1109Hz) sound very flat.
How can this be fixed?
GIT commit: f51dc11
Comments
This is a known issue. Best advice currently is to use another SoundFont —I suggest GeneralUser.
Is it known here in the issue tracker too?
It seems not, actually. It's come up in the forums probably half a dozen times—I believe the earliest mention is https://musescore.org/en/node/42051#comment-222906, and the most in-depth discussion is at https://musescore.org/en/node/50431 —but I can't find a duplicate in the tracker. So, thanks for filing this report, greychampion.
Ah, those, thanks for digging them up
Adding a link to my own solution: https://musescore.org/en/node/60026#comment-470226
Came up again: https://musescore.com/groups/improving-musescore-com/discuss/2080046#co…
Came up again: #110036: Intonation Problems
I applied a temporary fix this morning which removes the offending sample and stretches its two neighbours to cover the gap.
Result is a big improvement.
Please note - currently the fix is only in the SF2 version.
Download here......
https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B7cZM0RQwkwSZVJPQlUyTkRwY0E/view?usp=s…
There's a bit of a discontinuity in tone and speed of vibrato going from A6 to Bb6, but it's definitely an improvement. Thanks!
(I have to say I think my fix comes out better, but I understand there might be some uses for the SoundFont outside of MuseScore which would bring out a different difference.)
yes - some range out of tune - flat - but what does this temp fix mean here? is it all fixed ? - the guide to get samples baffles me as how to apply them - as I am a musician , not a computer expert- I have made a few copies of my work in case I mess things up and the score will be disposed of - I got the Poly thing , the sf2 stuff , and a big screen with hundreds of inst. comes on a yellow/white screen - then I'm stuck at a dead end cuz i dont know what to do with it ..... the linguistics confuse me
At this point, all the work is done for you. Forget everything from before—you don't need Polyphone or any of it. The only thing you need to do:
1. Download https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B7cZM0RQwkwSZVJPQlUyTkRwY0E/view?pref=….
2. It is a ZIP file—open that to extract a file called FluidR3Mono_GM2-307.sf2.
3. Move that SF2 file into your SoundFonts folder (see https://musescore.org/en/node/36171#install to learn where that folder is on your computer).
4. In MuseScore, go up the View menu and choose Synthesizer...
5. Click the "Add" button low down on the right to load the new SoundFont.
6. Click the "Set as Default" button so you won't have to do it again.
DONE!
wow ! - thanks Isaac - for the help = I'll look at it when mt headache leaves- and perhaps learn the SF2 thing later - t'would be nice to learn anyway.
will do how you posted - sounds easy , doesn't it ? maybe it is -
does it automatically correct all the dreadful flats once done ? ... or do I have to rewrite an entire score again .
thx - Brian
Thank Michael (the ChurchOrganist), not me—all I do is write how-tos around here. ;-)
Make sure to drink plenty of water. I hope you feel better soon.
will soon - thx
Answering your edited comment #13 above, all the notes will be changed together.
ok-i'll try to locate the sf2 file first somewhere in here - I believe it says VIOLIN B6 WAV - then I'll try what you posted - thx
Please, do no such thing! Do not do anything except what I said in this comment above .
no - did the wrong thing somewhere - clicked "Synth" on Muse - got the page with Fluid Zerebus - etc - clicked ADD - all I got was "fluidmono" something - no sf2 was added I think - confused-but thinking I dint load the sf2 to somewhere first -
this is confusing here = quoted
-INSTALL A SOUND FONT-
" After finding and decompressing a SoundFont (see →below), double-click to open it. In most cases, the SoundFont file type will already be associated with MuseScore, and MuseScore will start and a dialog will appear asking if you want to install the SoundFont. Occasionally an application other than MuseScore will be associated with the SoundFont file type; "
"load from score" and "save to score" is confusing too .,,and whats a Soundfonts folder ? couldn't even find one .. looked and looked for one - I think now I dont even have sf2's loaded in it yet
whats decompressing and where ? looked - got lost because no instructions that I can find - unsure how to decompress - and it didn't associate with Musescore at all
got the sf2 in front of me from General midi -
upon clicking general user - I got - Polyphone with Chris Collins name - ???
in short I've got the tools ready , but nothing.
is this a soundfont folder - attached pic? looked for 2 hours
At this point, I think the first thing to do is uninstall Polyphone from your machine, and the second thing to do is get help from a friend who has more experience with computers. I don't think there's much more I can do for you, but here's a final effort:
You do not need Polyphone. Delete that program.
You do not need Violin B6(L).wav. Delete that file.
You do need FluidR3Mono_GM2-307.sf2. Download it from https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B7cZM0RQwkwSZVJPQlUyTkRwY0E/view?pref=… if you haven't yet.
In your Preferences screenshot, I see you found the right folder. Congratulations! Now, open that folder, and drag FluidR3Mono_GM2-307.sf2 into it. (If this is the step you can't accomplish, you need get help from someone else.)
Then, in the same Synthesizer that I see you found in your second screenshot, click the Add button off to the right.
no wait sir - that "screenshot" I got from google images beacuse I was searching to see what it actually looked like to go from there - but I'm sure I dont have that chart because I looked high and low for it -
update - I reinstalled Fluidmono gm2 - 307 - got it - opened Muse - saw under edit - preferences- opened it - saw Grey chart - sounfonts - opened it - yet another box - opened it - another box - I tried ADD - another box - when I tried adding from desktop folder labelled FluidR3 mono -opened that one - says documents/soundfonts Musescorefonts - clicked that- it does not recognize - I tried OK and ADD - is this correct ? I know I have some progress here -
regards to you .
Like I said, please get help from a friend who can help you with your computer.
well - I dunno - ready to give up - others have too - cant even find a soundfont "folder" anywhere
See https://musescore.org/en/handbook/preferences#general.
Then look for the MuseScore2\Soundfonts Directory in 'My Documents', and put the soundfont there. Then see https://musescore.org/en/handbook/synthesizer#soundfont and add or replace the soundfont you just copied
no wait sir - that "screenshot" I got from google images beacuse I was searching to see what it actually looked like to go from there - but I'm sure I dont have that chart because I looked high and low for it -
update - I reinstalled Fluidmono gm2 - 307 - got it - opened Muse - saw under edit - preferences- opened it - saw Grey chart - sounfonts - opened it - yet another box - opened it - another box - I tried ADD - another box - when I tried adding from desktop folder labelled FluidR3 mono -opened that one - says documents/soundfonts Musescorefonts - clicked that- it does not recognize - OK or ADD - which choice is correct ?
cuz if I try ADD -another box opens a directory- on desktop where I store FLUIDR3MONO, it will not show that file Icon - I now have 3 things on Musescore synthesizer page all saying same thing fluidrmono SF3 etc ... which evidently is the wrong file - thers no dragging sf2 files anywhere because it wont show on ADD.. stumped
@brianstrange, I don't know if it can be helpful to you, but take a look at the attached image
thx -
but sry - dont know what that is - trying to ADD fluidmono sf2 - and it wont "see " it from desktop folder titled " fluidr3mono "
where ? soundfonts folder - the 2nd from the bottom ? if so , I tried it
dragging fluid r3 mono gm2 307 is now working - dragging should be a simple task - wont go in
besides there is an item in the box saying Musescore soundfonts already - doesnt say anything about a sf2 -307 anyway - no such animal in that box ...
in synthesizer , simply click add ? - nothing else ? hmmm.. i dont think so- another box says "choose directory " ... lost - I give up
In your image 'Preferences' # 19
I see two strange things: 'Librerie di suoni' and 'Immagini'.
Perhaps will better try use the MuseScore menu: Help/Revert to Factory Settings
thx-i'll do that
oh this is great - now I have no sound coming out at all - knew this would happen ... I quit
oh this is great - now I have no sound coming out at all - knew this would happen ... I quit
So do I. For your own good as well as ours, just find someone who has used computer file systems before, show them comment #12 , and ask them to do it for you. I've never gone to such extraordinary lengths to explain something before, because nobody else has ever required it, but I'm absolutely giving up.
... Heres a tiny short sample attachment of this piece to show how flat those top strings sound - eeire - it's only 2 % of the whole thing.
aha ! Found what you posted - i overlooked the small box called TREE thats the " display all" box .. this is where the b6L sample is...yes ? Now I followed carefully all , found the grid , entered 21 under b6 intersect adjusted the pitch like you said , it worked but dont see the question replace All Samples - I will attempt putting it to Muse- synthesizer.
Where would that pop up be ? looked and looked peace .
Don't mess with Polyphone at all. You don't need to—it's outdated instructions. The whole point would be to edit the SF2, but ChurchOrganist already did that step, and uploaded the fixed version to https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B7cZM0RQwkwSZVJPQlUyTkRwY0E/view?pref=…. That is all you need to download. Don't get distracted—nothing matters except for https://musescore.org/en/node/85636#comment-502876.
ok - I'll take it to the top of my list - but it worked thx to you and your insights- couldn't have done it without your help - changed the tuning right away , and I listened for the changes.
I actually tuned to the higher 25 on the cents box - did you listen to the sample ?
My deepest gratitude to you and Church O .
I'm keeping his link and all yours to my station ...
I have tried to extract the FluidR3Mono_GM_sf2.zip from
https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B7cZM0RQwkwSZVJPQlUyTkRwY0E/view?pref=…
and I always (well, always in the last three days) get an error report-
Upload Error (There were too many recent requests; please wait a while and try again.)
Any advice how to get around this?
I understand that this file fixes the out of tune viola ...
(and I have to add that Musescore.org has changed my life! What a program.)
That's bizarre. What method are you trying to use to extract it?
Hello there Isaac, many thanks for the comeback. Makes one feel a little less alone with ones tech problems.
I was using the suggested Zip Extractor and only now did I realize that you also have to have Google Drive on your computer for the Zip Extractor to decompress the files into. I have now downloaded GD.
This time the extraction went marginally better - it downloaded the four minor files, showed that the main file was 100% decompressed - but showed an error message as in screenshot 2
I'm running Windows 10.
I've just tried it again and again it shows the file 100% decompressed but with the same "Error Reading Zip File".
I am going to try the famous shut down and restart up again. As I'm going to lose this message I'll send it off and come back to you - hopefully with a success story.
Many thanks again Isaac, I really appreciate your time and expertise,
Best regards,
Graham
I doubt using an online converter service is the best way to go. Why not start by downloading the ZIP file directly to your computer (so if you go into your Downloads folder you'll find FluidR3Mono_GM_sf2.zip)?
Isaac, many thanks. I hadn't realized I could download it directly through the Google Drive symbol. It downloaded and it is now installed in Musescore. And the viola note no longer veers off key. I was a fan of Musescore.org before but having experienced your rapid online assistance I am fast becoming a fanatic. Absolutely great. Thank you,
Graham
Graham, I'm glad you were able to figure it out so easily with only the slightest hint in the right direction. ;-)
Dear Isaac,
I still have a problem with the c and the d of the viola. They make me cringe.
I attach a few bars to illustrate my problem.
Is it just me or do you hear it too?
Sorry to trouble you,
Graham
Your problem is that the viola is a different instrument with different samples. Consequently any adjustments to the Violin instrument won't make the slightest difference to the Viola.
Please open a new issue specifying the actual notes concerned either as MIDI note numbers, or as Helmholtz or Scientific notation.
I appreciate your comment but right from the beginning when I was referred to your post by Thomas Bonte my subject line always read 'viola out of tune', I never mentioned violins. Sorry about that. We were talking at cross purposes. I shall take your recommendation into consideration but I'm not sure I have the technical expertise to follow this matter up. Thanks again for your time.
See also #165281: Update FLuidR3Mono to the latest version before releasing 2.1
Automatically closed -- issue fixed for 2 weeks with no activity.
This is not true! I downloaded and tested it. It is still way out of tune and the violin is no improvement what so ever. Nothing has changed in that respect.
You downloaded what exactly?
This one that was mentioned on the same page: https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B7cZM0RQwkwSZVJPQlUyTkRwY0E/view?pref=…
But that is not the only one. I tried every recent FluidR3Mono GM soundfont that I could fint and tried it in respect to the violin and tested then with this score (see attachment)
Pay attention to the high notes and the climbing up effect of the violins, starting too low..
I explained it here: https://musescore.com/groups/3642106/discuss/3653821
So test it with the attached file:
So, if you have one that to your opinion does not have this problem. Please give me the download link.
Regards,
Gertim
OK, that as far as I'm aware is the latest and should have that bug fixed:
Version 2.307 Fix Violin B6 tuning issue by extending samples either side.
Guess I'll have to defer you to ChurchOrganist then.
I think he is aware of it, because he is a member of my Hauptwerk organ group...
I just wanted to mention that MuseScore_General v0.1.1 will have a proper fix for this issue. I have fixed the pitch bend in the B6 sample and re-added it to the instrument. I also further fine-tuned the intonation of both the violin and viola. I should have all of the pitch bends countered now, some through sample editing and others in realtime using the modulation envelope.