Automatically add horizontal frame before first system of parts

• Feb 23, 2011 - 02:43
Reported version
2.2
Type
Functional
Severity
S5 - Suggestion
Status
active
Project

Steps to reproduce bug
1. Open "bach-bc2" demo score
2. If you are using trunk build then switch to the Trumpet part tab
3. If you are using 1.0 then create the Trumpet part, save, and reload

Expected behavior: Trumpet part should be indented for the first system (approximately 15 mm)

Actual behavior: Trumpet part does not have an extra indent for the first system

Discussion: In the past this indent was created by adding 10 spaces to the Full Instrument Name. However the spaces no longer seem to stick (or perhaps never did).

MuseScore version: 1.0 stable or r. 4051 nightly build.

(Operating System: Windows 7)

first reported by Marc Sabatella: http://musescore.org/en/node/9443#comment-31445


Comments

Title Missing indentation for first system of parts Automatically add horizontal frame before first system of parts

"In the past this indent was created by adding 10 spaces to the Full Instrument Name. However the spaces no longer seem to stick (or perhaps never did)."

In MuseScore 2, the instrument name is hidden by default in parts with a single instrument, and horizontal frames are now the standard way to do this. But it would be nice if they could be added automatically, especially because not everyone will immediately figure out how to use a frame for this. Ideally, the frame should have a width of zero in the score, and perhaps 8sp in the parts.

I disagree with this feature request. First of all, the part name in the part score is already automatically placed on the top-left corner of the score, so I don't see any reason to waste space with an indentation in the part. Also, I don't see why making a part should indent, and I'm not used to seeing indentation in parts from scores made by other programs.

I'm sorry, looking charts that people have made me, it seems about 1/3 have the initial indent, and 2/3 don't. I must have been blind to it.

I've never really considered it, but now that I think about it, I don't see any purpose of the indent. There is already the title with part name and composer. What does the indent communicate to the player...what purpose does it serve? Maybe it is analogous to the the practice to indenting a paragraph? But then in most writing other than books, you don't use indents. Anyway, it seems that it just uses up space. Anyway, I would think if such an option was implemented, it should be off by default.

From quick search of internet, I find people that that it gives you room to label the staves (instrument names for example) without the information sticking out to the left, and that it is like how some writing styles use indents. I'm guessing that is the main rationale of that practice. But again, that is not needed since the part name is already written on the title's vertical frame. Anyway, musescore will automatically indent if there is an instrument name.

Anyway, seems redundant to have a vertical frame AND a horizontal frame.

I would suggest making this a style option. Perhaps an option on the score to generate horizontal frames when generating parts, sure, but I could also imagine making it a style option on the part to simply have the first system indented. This would make it easier to treat the score differently from the parts.

Personally, while I agree I've seen this convention used a lot, it doesn't seem to make any sense to me - I don't see any added value in doing this. So maybe it's a tradition that should slowly die out. FWIW, Gould doesn't appear to address this. Her examples mostly don't appear to show any indent, although some do.

I think, there is no style option for an automatic horizontal frame necessary
-> because setting a horizontal frame manually
-> at the beginning of the score only
-> has the same results - for all parts.

That sounds like the explanation for why most of jazz charts I play don't have indent.

I imagine since this distinction is mainly for jazz vs classical, then I think makes sense to have this be a global musescore preferences (i.e. not per-score), so user only needs to set this once depending on what type of musician the user primarily writes charts for.

By that logic, all sorts of things should be global preferences that currently aren't, including text styles and chord symbol rendering options. This is what styles and templates are for (and of course, a style sheet can be set as the default for new scores via Preferences).

I agree with Isaac - I'd much rather see this be a style option. I write both kinds of music - jazz & classical (hmm, "both kinds - country *and* western", for you Blues Brothers fans) and I imagine others do as well. Or maybe a checkbox in the File / Parts dialog. Or an element you insert manually but can somehow make be parts only. So, you add the frame while viewing a part and it shows everywhere, then you go to the score and mark it "invisible" or the equivalent.