Cannot change time stretch for ornament

• Jan 3, 2019 - 00:52
Reported version
3.0
Priority
P1 - High
Type
Functional
Frequency
Many
Severity
S4 - Minor
Reproducibility
Always
Status
active
Regression
Yes
Workaround
Yes
Project
  1. Select a note and add an ornament to it by double clicking in the "ornaments" palette.
  2. With the ornament selected, change the "time stretch" value in the inspector. For example, increase it from 0.1 (the default) to 0.2.
  3. Deselect the ornament then reselect it again. The value in the inspector has gone back to 0.1.

I can't find any way to change the value and make it stick.

MuseScore 3.0.0.20137 running on macOS.


Comments

Priority P2 - Medium

That time stretch value is meaningfull only for very few ornaments/articulations, like the fermatas, and apparently can only get set for those.

Guess we'd better not show that setting for those articulations where it isn't honored.

Even better would be to make it actually use the value. It would be nice to be able to set the speed of turns, trills, etc.

For tenuto a certain stretch is built in, and possibly different per instrument. same for staccatissmo, staccato, portato, marcato and sforzato. For fine tuning these use the piano roll editor

Tenuto doesn't have any time stretch (i.e. the tempo does not change). It does remove the gatetime, which means the note is held for its full duration rather than being cut off slightly before, but tenutos are often used to indicate that a note should be held for longer than its full duration (i.e. the tempo should slow down like for a fermata). This is not something that can be controlled via the piano roll editor.

Regression No Yes
Workaround No Yes

My sense is that that it was indeed never intended that stretch would apply for anything but fermatas, and this may have actually been part of the reason fermatas were pulled out of the Articulation class and made first class elements of their own - to avoid people accidentally setitng stretch on anything but a fermata. See for instance the discussion in #232056: Time Stretch with Multiple Voices, and the confusion users are having in support forum threads like https://musescore.org/en/node/205601

No doubt this change simplified some other things and probably fixed a number of fermata-related bugs along the way, but if it's common to rely on them to act as mini-fermatas (a usage I was unfamiliar with until recently), then it would be good to revisit this. Unfortunately, I fear it may not be trivial, which is why it's important to really good a handle on how common this usage and expectation is. I still kind of suspect at least some reports where people are asking about this are cases where people are confused and think this is going to just make an ordinary legato and not are not realizing this would actually convert the tenuto into a fermata.

For the record, adding invisible fermatas are the workaround for playback purposes.

I'm much more interested in ornaments like turns and trills. Being able to control the playback speed for those would be great. This would not affect how long the note lasts, just how it is played. This is similar to the (really useful!) feature that was added in 3.0 to change the playback speed of arpeggios.

@peastman, time stretch already has an accepted meaning of temporarily slowing down (or speeding up) the tempo for all instruments, so it is not appropriate to use it for other things like trill speed or legato/staccato of a single note or chord. There are other issues for those things, which you can find by searching. This issue is purely concerned with whether fermata-style time stretch should apply to elements other than fermatas.

I don't much care what the option is called. I'm just saying it would be a useful feature. Note, however, that the existing option for arpeggios is in fact called "stretch", so that word is already being used to mean two different things.